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Post by riogrande on Sept 21, 2013 16:17:17 GMT -8
Regarding HAL and IBM I used the IBM mainframe from a terminal in my school near Poughkeepsie back then. We used APL (A Programming Language) and the mainframe's name was ZOK. Like HAL and IBM, ZOK was one letter ahead of APL. Were you using Holerith cars back then? When I started college in 1977, we used the punch cars for my Fortran IV programming class, so when they switched to terminals on the PDP 11/70 mainframe, that was the cats meow. I think it had a whopping 36k of memory.
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Post by brokenrail on Sept 21, 2013 22:07:24 GMT -8
It was the other way around. Had the terminals first with APL in high school ('73?) and Fortran in College in '76. That was the advantage of going to HS in the shadow of IBM. Not sure about Holerith. Punch cards seem pre-historic now.
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Post by nscaler711 on Sept 22, 2013 3:10:46 GMT -8
I will defintely get a SP unit as these ran all the time next to ATSF in California. They are doing GN. Did these make it into BN Green? That would be nice in a second run. I bet they do EL Bicentennial down the road also. That engine is the best Bicentennial Paint Scheme hand's down. Your Nuts... So your saying as an AT&SF "fan" that the EL SDP45 bicentennial is better looking than the AT&SF SD45's Bicentennial? shocking... Well I can safely say I wont be buying one... I model modern times, and quite frankly a $300 ticket price for a piece of plastic with noise (and I like the noise) is WAY to much... Maybe I will go back to N scale where the prices of locomotives barely go above $150.... that and a 5 x 9 table will allow for 26" N scale curves.... here I come 89' flats/auto racks and long freights...
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Post by trebor on Sept 23, 2013 7:28:38 GMT -8
It is interesting that HAL was used, but it was a play of letters on the name for the most famous computer company at that time, IBM. The hidden issue is each letter of HAL is one letter prior to IBM. Larry Yeppers - way ahead of you on it! I've known about the HAL/IBM thing since my 20's, maybe my teens back when dinosaurs roamed the earth, and SDP45's were still wet behind the ears (on topic content!). I actually saw 2001 A Space Odyssy as a kid when it originally shown in the theaters in the 60's (Travis Air Force Base if I recall correctly). As an undergraduate in college I took an English Composition class where we watched movies and wrote papers analyzing movies. I included 2001 among the movies I did papers on - it wasn't really until then that I understood the movie properly down to most of the symbolism including the final scenes after Dave left the lobotomized HAL and Discovery, and took his EVA pod into the star gate and rushed headlong to his destiny, the next step in the evolution of man and all that stuff! I was an avid reader of many of Arthur C Clarke's sci fi novels as a teen in the 1970's including 2001, Earthlight, Islands in the Sky, etc. But I didn't get to Rendezvous With Rama until a year ago. Apparently Morgan Freeman bought the rights to do the film but he is getting pretty long in the tooth now. I'm going to make an XXX-rated train movie, with Steven Segal, "BEHIND" THE BN GREEN DOOR, with Big BN Domes and undec cabooses. I've placed 2ea for SP EL and GN. SP as delivered is better for me as I have lotsa UP SP Milw passenger equipment. StupiD SP question on my part, did the 2-tone P-S bi-levels run behind the SDP45's in any numbers? I also recall Harrimans used with the 45's.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2013 9:27:29 GMT -8
StupiD SP question on my part, did the 2-tone P-S bi-levels run behind the SDP45's in any numbers? I also recall Harrimans used with the 45's. The Walthers model represents the last series of bi-levels purchased by SP. These cars were delivered in 1968 and numbered #3731-3745. They came in the solid gray paint scheme with stainless steel doors, green tinted windows and florescent lighting. The current Walthers model of a 1968 built car is purely fantasy. The first two orders of gallery cars were delivered in 1955, numbered 3700-3709, and 1957, numbered 3710-3730, both lots were delivered in two tone. These had six windows of the same size each side of the center vestibule. The windows were clear glass and the lighting was incandescent. 1968 was also the time period when SP switched over to solid gray for all its commute equipment. The SDP45's were not used in commuter service until after May 1, 1971 when Amtrak took over intercity service. From espeerailfan.net site: Harrimans cars" SP then had 100 seat 72ft commute cars built as below, commonly known on the SP as Subs short for suburban, you may also hear them referred to as 'Harrimans'; this is totally incorrect, anything built after 1914 is not a Harriman design in fact the SPTHS book refers to them as arch-roof coach. These were class 72-IC-1 to 72-IC-3.
The 72 refers to the length of the passenger compartment, they were actually 80ft 9inches over the diaphragms including the vestibules. The IC probably means Interurban coach and there were 3 classes of them. They also rode on 4-wheel trucks rather than the mainline coaches with 6 wheel trucks. 75 were delivered as below they were all pretty much the same except that last order had different trucks.
72-IC-1 - 60 built 1924 4-TC-2 trucks #2085-2144 72-IC-2 - 10 built 1924 4-TC-2 trucks #2145-2154 72-IC-3 - 5 built 1927 4-TC-3 trucks #2155-2159
Never renumbered, air-conditioned or modernized.
Originally delivered in SP Dark Olive Green, repainted two-tone gray in 1954 and later to solid Lark Dark Gray after 1968. Always with a black roof. Some lasted until the end of commute operations." Gallery cars"Lastly SP had three orders of Bi-levels or Gallery Cars built, they might be more properly called Multi-level as SP classed them as below:
85-MLC-1 built 1955 #3700-3709 85-MLC-2 built 1957 #3710-3730 85-MLC-3 built 1968 #3731-3745
SP operations did not require Cab Cars they did not run push/pull like other commuter services, power was always leading.
Walthers represents the last order that were delivered, so they are only correct if painted solid Lark Dark Gray."
Power Assignments
From mid 1968 GP9P's and Train Masters hauling a mix of 72-IC-x and 85-MLC-x's.
From mid 1971 SDP45's, GP9P's and Train Masters hauling a mix of 72-IC-x and 85-MLC-x's.
From mid 1974 GP40P-2's, SDP45's, and GP9P's hauling a mix of 72-IC-x and 85-MLC-x's.
1985 was the end of SP commute operations, CalTrain took over from this date.
I'd say if you had models of six window 50's built cars some may still be in two tone when the SDP45's began commuter service. But using the Walthers model, the cars would be solid gray.
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Post by trebor on Sept 23, 2013 10:11:45 GMT -8
Excellent there Quick Draw. I am always fuzzy on SP passenger equipment and dates, it's a very interesting, confusing and vast subject.
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Post by dti406 on Sept 23, 2013 10:12:36 GMT -8
Regarding HAL and IBM I used the IBM mainframe from a terminal in my school near Poughkeepsie back then. We used APL (A Programming Language) and the mainframe's name was ZOK. Like HAL and IBM, ZOK was one letter ahead of APL. Were you using Holerith cars back then? When I started college in 1977, we used the punch cars for my Fortran IV programming class, so when they switched to terminals on the PDP 11/70 mainframe, that was the cats meow. I think it had a whopping 36k of memory. You guys got to use the new stuff, I learned how to wire the boards to make the 085 Collater, 514 Reproducing Card Punch, 402 and 407 Accounting Machines Work. Then I got to program in Fortran IV with the punch cards, the output came only on punch cards which were fed into the prewired 407 Accounting Machine to show you the output. Also programmed the IBM 1401 which used Autocoder programming language. My first job was with an IBM System 3 Card System. Had 8K of Memory, need 23 programs just to get to the P/R Checks as each program had to be under 8096 bytes. I made a one column adjustment on the Check Writing Program which took the program over the 8096, so I had to make some other changes to make it work. Also the compiler was all on cards, there were 4,000 cards in the compiler which had to be fed into the computer every time you wanted to recompile a program. Rick J
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Post by riogrande on Sept 23, 2013 15:23:34 GMT -8
You guys got to use the new stuff, I learned how to wire the boards to make the 085 Collater, 514 Reproducing Card Punch, 402 and 407 Accounting Machines Work. Then I got to program in Fortran IV with the punch cards, the output came only on punch cards which were fed into the prewired 407 Accounting Machine to show you the output. Also programmed the IBM 1401 which used Autocoder programming language. My first job was with an IBM System 3 Card System. Had 8K of Memory, need 23 programs just to get to the P/R Checks as each program had to be under 8096 bytes. I made a one column adjustment on the Check Writing Program which took the program over the 8096, so I had to make some other changes to make it work. Also the compiler was all on cards, there were 4,000 cards in the compiler which had to be fed into the computer every time you wanted to recompile a program. Rick J This was at Sacramento State Univ so I'm not sure where they were on the timeline of hardware - ahead or behind companies? We used a couple of different computers at CSUS, and my memory is fuzzy - DEC PDP 11/70 RSTS time share and CDC (Conrol Data Corp) Cyber - don't remember the model number. I decided programming was way too tedius for me so I switched to geology where I did stick with that major finishing my BS and MS degree. Sounds like you are way ahead of me so I'm officially in the younger portion of the oldfart club. But to the young just out of college folk I feel pretty ancient. Thanks for making me feel a bit younger again! =P
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Post by roadkill on Sept 23, 2013 16:34:20 GMT -8
I will defintely get a SP unit as these ran all the time next to ATSF in California. They are doing GN. Did these make it into BN Green? That would be nice in a second run. I bet they do EL Bicentennial down the road also. That engine is the best Bicentennial Paint Scheme hand's down. Your Nuts... So your saying as an AT&SF "fan" that the EL SDP45 bicentennial is better looking than the AT&SF SD45's Bicentennial? shocking... Well I can safely say I wont be buying one... I model modern times, and quite frankly a $300 ticket price for a piece of plastic with noise (and I like the noise) is WAY to much... Maybe I will go back to N scale where the prices of locomotives barely go above $150.... that and a 5 x 9 table will allow for 26" N scale curves.... here I come 89' flats/auto racks and long freights... Sorry pal, but I'm with atsfan... although I believe the N&W's bicentennial gave the EL units a run for the money.
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Post by trebor on Sept 24, 2013 5:00:09 GMT -8
All the Bi-centenials are too gaudy for me, I'd take a well weathered PRR GP9 with induction ant. any day.
Back to SDP45's, I will also get CR'd ex EL if done, and of course CR dress blues. I have some 35mm, yes film, shots of a lone CR unit in blue sitting on the IHB just north of Proviso Yard. Must have been 1980 or so. Climbed onto embankment for the shots. No arrests, a wave and then a pleasant conversation with the crew.
SP or GN passenger trains with a SDP45 and a F-unit or Milw FP45 and an F always are an interesting comparison of old and new power.
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Post by brokenrail on Sept 24, 2013 10:00:30 GMT -8
I have to agree about the bicentennials being gaudy. However it was fun to spot one now and then. I worked a yard derailment when the BN 1776 (U30C) went by on the main. Then worked a derailment where the 1976 (SDP40) was in the ditch after hitting a truck. Later I rode the 1876 (SD40-2) on an ID run. So, even though I model pre-BN GN I couldn't resist and picked up the models of the 1776 and 1876. I also ran the Desert Storm 1991 (SD60M) but that's too new for me to model (and I never liked the SD60M). Seeing the one-of-a-kind units does add interest when watching trains but I can't see going out of my way to chase one. I also like the workaday units in their grime. In fact I've never been able to get too excited about preserved RR equipment. I'm glad its been saved and I appreciate the effort but it just doesn't feel the same as the real thing.
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