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Post by Great-Northern-Willmar Div on Dec 29, 2014 17:04:44 GMT -8
We have C-430's, C-636's, FL9's and I guess soon C-415's, yet we do not have a NW2 phase IV or an SW7.
What is wrong with the Athearn SW7 shell? Too wide, too short, length what if anything is incorrect about the shell?
My understanding is the BLI model is a mutt.
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Post by tankcarsrule on Dec 29, 2014 18:42:48 GMT -8
I think the only thing wrong is it's to wide. It looks nice from the side. BLI builds some nice, some fair and some poor.
Regards, Bobby
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Post by edwardsutorik on Dec 29, 2014 18:56:46 GMT -8
I think the only thing wrong is it's to wide. It looks nice from the side. BLI builds some nice, some fair and some poor. Regards, Bobby The hood width is correct. Ed
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Post by jbilbrey on Dec 29, 2014 19:03:43 GMT -8
Athearn used some early drawings for the SW1500 when it cut the molds for their model. Therefore, the model came out looking nothing like the SW1500. Instead, it looked more like the SW7. I have also heard that the hood is too wide, but I have never heard by how much. I don't think it was as bad as the GP35's and SD 40/45's. Besides the solid radiator openings on the front and top, the 2D detailing of the air-tanks bothered me the most about them. It would take some hacking to make a more credible looking fuel tank and air tanks. A C&C cab would be an improvement over the stock cab.
I wonder if a better solution would be to use a P2K SW and graft parts from a SW7 shell. One would end up with a better drive, fuel/air-tanks, and walkways. The hood would be more in-scale as well. With little searching, one can find older releases hovering around the $60 range.
James Bilbrey LaVergne, TN
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Post by onequiknova on Dec 29, 2014 19:07:40 GMT -8
I've heard the hood is too wide also. Another complaint I've heard is the lack of latches on the doors.
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Post by Donnell Wells on Dec 29, 2014 19:21:25 GMT -8
I think the only thing wrong is it's to wide. It looks nice from the side. BLI builds some nice, some fair and some poor. Regards, Bobby The hood width is correct. Ed Ed is right. The hood width is correct.
Donnell
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Post by llxlocomotives on Dec 29, 2014 19:23:29 GMT -8
Besides the choice of horn, the model looks close to the real thing. Wouldn't a p2K SW9 be a better basis for the model? What makes the BLI model a mutt? Larry www.llxlocomotives.com
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Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2014 20:45:52 GMT -8
I think the only thing wrong is it's to wide. It looks nice from the side. BLI builds some nice, some fair and some poor. Regards, Bobby I think the Athearn SW is only about 1.5 inches too wide. EMD switcher hoods were wider than the road switchers where the old Athearn "wide body" (because of the motor size) was very noticable. The specifics have been posted here before.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Dec 29, 2014 22:00:56 GMT -8
I've heard the hood is too wide also. Another complaint I've heard is the lack of latches on the doors. The hood's the right width. I just measured it. The doors have latches. I just looked at them. If I were you, I'd stop listening to those folks. Ed
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Post by onequiknova on Dec 29, 2014 23:05:24 GMT -8
I've heard the hood is too wide also. Another complaint I've heard is the lack of latches on the doors. The hood's the right width. I just measured it. The doors have latches. I just looked at them. If I were you, I'd stop listening to those folks. Ed My mistake, Looking at pictures, the Athearn does indeed have door latches, it just has too many of them. It is also devoid of a battery box door under the cab. The front and rear cab windows are off. A Cannon cab and chisel would fix those problems though. How does the narrow part of the taper measure out?
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Post by Mark R. on Dec 29, 2014 23:36:48 GMT -8
An NW2 Phase IV can be made relatively easy by adding the appropriate hood louvers to a Kato NW2 Phase II .... Mark.
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Post by Great-Northern-Willmar Div on Dec 30, 2014 7:29:04 GMT -8
An NW2 Phase IV can be made relatively easy by adding the appropriate hood louvers to a Kato NW2 Phase II .... Mark. That is a very nice model. Love the old time marker lights on the front.
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Post by Spikre on Dec 30, 2014 9:59:23 GMT -8
never have had ANY BB SW7 that ran decently. had the Jet motor with metal trucks,ran way too hot if it even ran. had later ones with the thin motor that ran stop and go,then got hot. had the slim motor and Plastic Sideframe trucks,it ran better,but nothing to get excited about. maybe comparing them to a Hobbytown Chassis wasn't fair ? but do have a New SW1000 and correct SW1500 that are the best running out of the Box BBs from the 1992 Era Ever here !! go figure ? never even Hard Wired them yet. too bad EL had SW7s,but never had SW1000/15000s . my loss . Spikre
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Post by edwardsutorik on Dec 30, 2014 11:31:50 GMT -8
Looking at pictures, the Athearn does indeed have door latches, it just has too many of them. It is also devoid of a battery box door under the cab. The front and rear cab windows are off. A Cannon cab and chisel would fix those problems though. How does the narrow part of the taper measure out? Yup, the latches are kinda doubled. Betcha the die maker thought each door just HAD to have a latch to keep it closed. Quite logical. But wrong. But, as you noted, easily fixed. On an undecorated model. Or an all black one. I don't see a battery box door problem. Yet. If you're talking about the cab sides, lotsa SW7's had no doors. If you're talking about behind the cab, it looks like the top lifts up. And Athearn put some kind of latchy things there. For me, the biggest problem with the Athearn SW7 is that it has a late SW7 cab, while the rest of the body is an early one. So, should Cannon replenish the switcher cabs, that would be my fix too. My "big" discovery was that the louver count on the lower rear of the cab side is off. But I think Mr. die maker made each louver a bit too wide, and chose to just fill up the proper area with louver strips, instead of having the right count and making the whole thing too big. Again--Cannon cab. I surely hope I have a couple of the Cannon cabs around here. Oh, yeah. I'm pretty sure the back of the taper is right. I don't recall anyone ever saying their Cannon cab wouldn't fit. And that's the kinda thing that could make a person loudly crabby. Ed
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Post by edwardsutorik on Dec 30, 2014 11:37:25 GMT -8
Spikre,
Interesting about the motors and such.
I've got a Southern cow-and-calf SW7. Real nice lookin'. Box stock, so far. Except that I put a drawbar between the units and also a jumper so each one has 16 wheel pickup. It WILL NOT STALL. Very convenient. I've never really broken it in. Or even oiled it. And it's old. Curiously, it seems to sorta run kinda sorta pretty good for an old Athearn. Enough so that I'm wondering whether I'll actually remotor the pair someday. First I'll do that attempt at break in. Oh, yeah. Gotta DCC the set, too. And add weight. And.........
Ed
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Post by tankcarsrule on Dec 30, 2014 12:30:16 GMT -8
Well, I got things started. Notice, I said I think the hood's to wide.
Regards, Bobby
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Post by Judge Doom on Dec 30, 2014 13:40:59 GMT -8
The hood is ever slightly wider than the Proto 2000 hood - it might be 1/4 of a scale food wider at best, but it "looks" ok compared to a widebody BB GP7 or GP35 you can notice from a mile away. BUT, the length of the BB SW7 is questionable - the entire unit is about a scale half to a foot longer than the P2K SW8/9/900/1200, and measuring both together. The BB SW7 shares the same chassis as the Athearn S12, so this could be the source of the compromise.
Ignoring hood details that were touched upon, the Athearn cab is overall an icky thing. Rear windows look undersized, and the two middle front windows sit too high up. Junk the cab, replace with a C&C.
You might be happier with the BLI unit, or modifying a P2K SW9 into an SW7 depending on the phase. The Proto has a much better drive, better looking and finer tooling, and separately applied air tanks.
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Post by onequiknova on Dec 30, 2014 14:10:48 GMT -8
I saw a reference on another forum that some rivet detail on the Cannon cab is covered up by the Athearn hood, telling me the taper is too wide. Can anyone confirm?
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Post by edwardsutorik on Dec 30, 2014 14:23:21 GMT -8
Comparing the Athearn SW7 with plans for the various EMD switchers in the famous Kalmbach plan book reveals:
The drawings have a hood width of .97 to .975. The Athearn model has a hood width of .98, but it's also got a coat of SP grey on it. So it looks like the hood width is correct. So that would then potentially make the P2K hood too narrow.
Ah, but the length. The body looks to be .10 too long. And the additional length appears to be at the front of the body. That is, if you cut out about .10 from behind the front grill, you get a proper length. This would appear to include the deck. A vertical cut would, unfortunately, intersect to top radiator "grill" and be kinda nasty to deal with. But perhaps doable, with care.
I believe the Athearn S12 came along quite a bit later than the SW7, and I doubt that the folks would have planned so far ahead as to screw up the SW7 to get the S12. That DID have a fat hood.
Ed
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Post by Spikre on Dec 30, 2014 16:40:34 GMT -8
the Baldwin S-whatever came out about late 72,or some time in 73. it was one of the 1st Flywheel Equipped BBs. when did the SW7 get flywheels ? [after all the Non-Flyweel ones were sold] for some reason the several EL Baldwins always ran better than the SWs did,but all the SWs here were used,never bought a new one. and after several hours of thought,never had any with the Plastic sideframe trucks. but did have a dummy Baldwin with plastic sideframes ,,possibly ? will think some more about these critters. but the actual Shell Detail on the 1966 Athearn SW7 was not as good as the 1950 era Varney NW2. did Bob Lindsey or JJ Munson do the Varney Shell ? have seen,but don't own any 1953 era Lindsey NW2 shells,and they don't look as sharp as the detail on the Varney shell. both Varney and Athearn have the same Pilot/Footboards mistake,both Varney and Athearn had bad looking wire handrail details,Lindsey had Cast Brass,and looked better,but still had the Pilot mistakes. am convinced there is a connection between the 3 models. Spikre
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Post by edwardsutorik on Dec 30, 2014 16:57:57 GMT -8
I've got a Varney shell here, somewhere. I don't recall it being much different in "fineness" than the Athearn; but, since it's being shy, I can't back up that opinion. And it had some pretty thin walls, as it isn't very heavy. Not like, say, the Cary fat-bodied SW1500. If I could stand to look at it, it'd be a great item on top of a Hobbytown drive.
I'll betcha the reason the Athearn SW7 shell is too long is that it wouldn't fit on the smallest drive they could build, and still be scale length. So they widened it, lengthwise.
Ed
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Post by Spikre on Dec 30, 2014 18:16:48 GMT -8
Ed, the Hood detail of the Varney shell is rather fine when stripped of whatever paint they used on the RTR versions. the Kits were always Un-Decorated. the Cab isn't as sharp as the hood,best to replace it with a Cannon Cab. Prototype Modeler had a nice article about 1977 on building a Frisco NW2 from the Varney shell. and what about the Revell NW2 shell ? with its U.P. Specific ladders and tool box detailing ? was that one 50 years ahead of its time ? Spikre
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Post by Brakie on Dec 30, 2014 18:21:55 GMT -8
If one would leave the calipers and scale rule in their storage box one would find that SW7 isn't all that bad for a mid 60 era shell.
It still remains a popular switcher.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Dec 30, 2014 19:02:15 GMT -8
If one would leave the calipers and scale rule in their storage box one would find that SW7 isn't all that bad for a mid 60 era shell. It still remains a popular switcher. I do like mine. They look "right", as compared to the unfortunate Athearn Baldwin S12. I enjoy mine. Ed
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Post by Judge Doom on Dec 30, 2014 19:41:58 GMT -8
Someone asks a question about the accuracy of a model, specifically mentioning dimensions, answers are given and discussion commences pertaining to the accuracy of those dimensions, people are told to stop measuring and enjoy the models...
I give up. Measure it yourselves. Or don't. Whatever.
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Post by Great-Northern-Willmar Div on Dec 30, 2014 19:49:10 GMT -8
Someone asks a question about the accuracy of a model, specifically mentioning dimensions, answers are given and discussion commences pertaining to the accuracy of those dimensions, people are told to stop measuring and enjoy the models... I give up. Measure it yourselves. Or don't. Whatever. Thank you. I want to know if the shell is dimensionally accurate. I can work with a lot of stuff if the basic dimensions are correct. But then again, I'm the guy that split a blue box DD40 down the middle and made it scale width hood so I can accurately model a UP DD35A.
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Post by Brakie on Dec 31, 2014 7:31:59 GMT -8
Someone asks a question about the accuracy of a model, specifically mentioning dimensions, answers are given and discussion commences pertaining to the accuracy of those dimensions, people are told to stop measuring and enjoy the models... I give up. Measure it yourselves. Or don't. Whatever. Actually I was trying to point out that SW7 shell is about 50 years old and one should consider that before breaking out the calipers and ruler.Its far from today's so called "standards".. And as we all know there are better models of EMD end switchers available.
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Post by catt on Dec 31, 2014 11:45:19 GMT -8
The problem with better models is that it is harder to find things to nit pic.Besides I am perfectly happy with my SW 15 oops -7 switchers the 4 that still look like a SW-7 and the one that looks like a center cab narrow gauge diesel.By the way they are all antiques with round gray motors and cast flywheels.and of course metal sideframes.
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Post by lvrr325 on Dec 31, 2014 14:00:44 GMT -8
That and the Revell NW2 shell aren't too bad considering their ages.
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Post by Spikre on Dec 31, 2014 15:00:18 GMT -8
EMD Switchers over the years: Varney-1950,NW2,cast metal kit,4 wheel drive,DC-60 motor,extra Power truck conversion kit to 8 wheel drive available. Lindsey about 1953,NW2,Cast Brass mostly,Lindsey power truck powered,4 wheel drive,geared truck available to convert to 8 wheel drive,Kit. Revell,about 1956 NW2,RTR,some 8 wheel drive,some 4 wheel drive,DC60 motor ? PFM about 1958,RTR Lindsey Switchers assembled in Japan,when supply of Lindsey Power units ran out they used a drive by Baker. Varney about 1959,RTR NW2,8 wheel drive,plastic gear boxes,Japanese KM-1 motor that the front plastic piece usually cracked and broke . Lindberg about 1963,SW600 but closer to SW1,4 wheel drive,RTr made of Delrin. Athearn 1966 SW1500 but closer to SW7 PHS-2,8 wheel drive,upgraded to Flywheels over the years,considered RTR,but actually a Kit. AHM about 1975,SW1,with 4 wheel drive,RTR body too long to fit drive ? Con-Cor about 1985,MP15,Kato Chassis,RTR,made in China late 1990s,8 wheel drive. Con Cor-about 1985,NW2 on Kato RTR chassis,Revell body,8 wheel drive. Athearn about 1992- SW1000,considered a Kit,but sold as RTR,8 wheel drive. Athearn about 1992-SW1500,considered a kit,but sold as RTR,8 whhel drive. Walthers about 1993,SW1,RTR,8 wheel drive. Kato,about 1995,NW2,RTR,8 wheel drive. Proto about 1996 SW9,SW1200,RTR,8 wheel drive. any one want to cover the EMDs after 2000 ? Spikre
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