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Post by simulatortrain on Oct 23, 2018 8:49:29 GMT -8
Count me among those disappointed with the issues listed above. Still, considering these and the Walthers ACFs (ugh) are the only RBOX cars appropriate for my era, I don't have much issue with fixing the bugs myself, so long as the dimensions and paint are good. For one, chunky stirrups or not, if they're plastic, I'm gonna cut them off. There are worse problems the cars could have.
BIG BUT
I don't pretend to speak for everyone, but what magnifies the issues somewhat in my book is that there are issues at all at this price point. I certainly would welcome any efforts to improve them, even if it does mean further delays.
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randyb
Junior Member
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Post by randyb on Oct 23, 2018 10:17:40 GMT -8
Following. I had high hopes for this car and would easily have been in for close to a dozen (Chessie, RBOX and others) for my 1985 era modeling. The response Brian Bennett received concerns me greatly. I have interacted with him through other venues and trust his judgement and observations.
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Post by delta767332er on Oct 23, 2018 11:52:53 GMT -8
Count me among those disappointed with the issues listed above. Still, considering these and the Walthers ACFs (ugh) are the only RBOX cars appropriate for my era, I don't have much issue with fixing the bugs myself, so long as the dimensions and paint are good. For one, chunky stirrups or not, if they're plastic, I'm gonna cut them off. There are worse problems the cars could have. BIG BUT I don't pretend to speak for everyone, but what magnifies the issues somewhat in my book is that there are issues at all at this price point. I certainly would welcome any efforts to improve them, even if it does mean further delays. Yes, absolutely. That makes me want to clarify or emphasize that all of my comments are completely in the context of the price point of this car and how it is being marketed/touted by PWRS/NARC. Walthers deciding to junk-tool an ACF 5090 was just as frustrating, but didn’t merit conversation because there was no hiding behind what it was/is. That said, I’m not so sure that model with everything molded on doesn’t almost make a better initial presentation than this thing! (Said tongue in cheek.....sort of.) And it goes without saying that any potential frustrations with this release are exacerbated by who’s releasing it and how they choose to market their products and interact with their customers. The stories of the PORTERS initiation phone calls would be hilarious if they weren’t so.......true. I know; I’m a survivor of one.
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Post by stottman on Oct 23, 2018 20:58:39 GMT -8
Count me among those disappointed with the issues listed above. Still, considering these and the Walthers ACFs (ugh) are the only RBOX cars appropriate for my era, I don't have much issue with fixing the bugs myself, so long as the dimensions and paint are good. For one, chunky stirrups or not, if they're plastic, I'm gonna cut them off. There are worse problems the cars could have. BIG BUT I don't pretend to speak for everyone, but what magnifies the issues somewhat in my book is that there are issues at all at this price point. I certainly would welcome any efforts to improve them, even if it does mean further delays. Yes, absolutely. That makes me want to clarify or emphasize that all of my comments are completely in the context of the price point of this car and how it is being marketed/touted by PWRS/NARC. Walthers deciding to junk-tool an ACF 5090 was just as frustrating, but didn’t merit conversation because there was no hiding behind what it was/is. That said, I’m not so sure that model with everything molded on doesn’t almost make a better initial presentation than this thing! (Said tongue in cheek.....sort of.) And it goes without saying that any potential frustrations with this release are exacerbated by who’s releasing it and how they choose to market their products and interact with their customers. The stories of the PORTERS initiation phone calls would be hilarious if they weren’t so.......true. I know; I’m a survivor of one. The Atlas 5090 is at least dimensionally accurate, when I compared it to the "Railbox" drawings from a 30 year old issue of RMC. And like you said, it is honest about its shortcomings.
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Post by delta767332er on Oct 24, 2018 4:53:52 GMT -8
I was speaking of the Walthers Plate B ACF. IIRC, I think the rib detail on the Trainman Plate C is a little shallow?
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Post by John Sheridan on Oct 24, 2018 5:24:32 GMT -8
No, I am not still collecting artwork. Artwork has been at the factory for months. What I am correcting is some color mis-matches and a few instances where they for some reason changed typefaces from the supplied artwork. Corrections will be sent to the factory in the next day or two (also working on the N scale cars). These won't go into production until the corrections are made and new samples sent to us. Typically, the font changes on the artwork due to the fact that you sent the artwork with imbedded fonts & the factory does not have them on-file. It will change to default font depending on which product they use: Illustrator, Corel, etc.Happens all the time at the factory unless you provide them with the font. Sincethey are on the other side of the planet, they typically don't know which fonts you used unless you convert font to curves. If you need help with artwork, let me know as I can set aside some time to work on it.
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Post by csx3305 on Oct 24, 2018 5:49:23 GMT -8
After studying the photos for a solid twenty minutes I must admit I fail to see how the tooling on these is so terrible. Looks very similar in detail to the Exactrail waffle and the Intermountain 5277 to me. Yeah yeah, I know....10 and 15 year old tooling and all that. Price is the same as the IMRC car was back in 2005 too.
For me the real issue is the repaint dates on the CSX cars. This knocks me down from at least eight cars I had planned to purchase down to two at most. And that’s if any of the SBD or C&O numbers show up in my ORER. I seem to recall most if not all the SBD cars had been patched to CSXT by 1992.
So now I’m trying to decide if a measly two cars is worth paying shipping charges from presumably Canada plus the hassle of getting a cheap Straight Talk phone from Wal Mart and a low limit throw away auxiliary credit card to make the transaction with PWRS....no way are they getting my primary card number and telephone number. Not going to go through that again.
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Post by talltim on Oct 24, 2018 5:57:46 GMT -8
The stirrups mounted on the outside look a lot thinner than the ones mounted on the inside.
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Post by nsc39d8 on Oct 24, 2018 7:00:45 GMT -8
I am a modeler that does not trust judgements made or based on photographs! There is no depth perception with 2 dimensional portraits just an illusion. I generally make a final decision when I see the model in person. I have ordered one in the Railbox Southern repaint. I need 5277's in Southern but no one does these.
So far I think PWRS has done a good job of keeping everyone up to date on these cars. I am one that has had conversations with PWRS and I first found the PORTERS talk to be long winded but I now know how to work thru their website a lot easier and have found long out of stock models still available thru them. Recent this was a nice email exchange about login problems, was a very pleasant experience. I have no affiliation with PWRS except as a customer.
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Post by canrailfan on Oct 24, 2018 7:02:42 GMT -8
So now I’m trying to decide if a measly two cars is worth paying shipping charges from presumably Canada plus the hassle of getting a cheap Straight Talk phone from Wal Mart and a low limit throw away auxiliary credit card to make the transaction with PWRS....no way are they getting my primary card number and telephone number. Not going to go through that again. It has been pointed out several times that PWRS ships U.S. orders from their warehouse in WA by USPS. I believe you can use PayPal to make a credit card payment so that PWRS would never see your card information.
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Post by GP40P-2 on Oct 24, 2018 8:33:09 GMT -8
getting a cheap Straight Talk phone from Wal Mart and a low limit throw away auxiliary credit card to make the transaction with PWRS....no way are they getting my primary card number and telephone number. Not going to go through that again. If you can find one, a pay phone works great. Then buy a Visa gift card and use it for the purchase. And for the complete trifecta, ship it to work, a Mailboxes Etc, a relatives house, anything but your own address.
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Post by fcixdarrell on Oct 24, 2018 8:52:19 GMT -8
No, I am not still collecting artwork. Artwork has been at the factory for months. What I am correcting is some color mis-matches and a few instances where they for some reason changed typefaces from the supplied artwork. Corrections will be sent to the factory in the next day or two (also working on the N scale cars). These won't go into production until the corrections are made and new samples sent to us. Typically, the font changes on the artwork due to the fact that you sent the artwork with imbedded fonts & the factory does not have them on-file. It will change to default font depending on which product they use: Illustrator, Corel, etc.Happens all the time at the factory unless you provide them with the font. Sincethey are on the other side of the planet, they typically don't know which fonts you used unless you convert font to curves. If you need help with artwork, let me know as I can set aside some time to work on it. John, Thank you for your offer, I appreciate it. We use a professional graphic artist that's been involved in doing this in this industry for 25 years or more. This is the first time they've changed the font on their own. Again, thanks for your generous offer.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2018 9:37:21 GMT -8
Count me among those disappointed with the issues listed above. Still, considering these and the Walthers ACFs (ugh) are the only RBOX cars appropriate for my era, I don't have much issue with fixing the bugs myself, so long as the dimensions and paint are good. For one, chunky stirrups or not, if they're plastic, I'm gonna cut them off. There are worse problems the cars could have. BIG BUT I don't pretend to speak for everyone, but what magnifies the issues somewhat in my book is that there are issues at all at this price point. I certainly would welcome any efforts to improve them, even if it does mean further delays. Yes, absolutely. That makes me want to clarify or emphasize that all of my comments are completely in the context of the price point of this car and how it is being marketed/touted by PWRS/NARC. Walthers deciding to junk-tool an ACF 5090 was just as frustrating, but didn’t merit conversation because there was no hiding behind what it was/is. That said, I’m not so sure that model with everything molded on doesn’t almost make a better initial presentation than this thing! (Said tongue in cheek.....sort of.) And it goes without saying that any potential frustrations with this release are exacerbated by who’s releasing it and how they choose to market their products and interact with their customers. The stories of the PORTERS initiation phone calls would be hilarious if they weren’t so.......true. I know; I’m a survivor of one. Ahhhh..."porters"...Yes. These were long and tedious conversations in which it was explained how to use the system.
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Post by drolsen on Oct 25, 2018 7:38:58 GMT -8
Completely understand the dilemma of "badly needing" lowering one's standards. That's why I haven't completely canceled all of my preorders, even with the frustrations of what I'm seeing. As an early 90s modeler with a paper mill and printing company ON my planned layout, as well as lots of bridge paper traffic, I just don't have the luxury of ignoring this car on principle, as much as I'd like. As it is, my plan is to buy a reasonable amount (assuming the paint and lettering is usable) to improve them (high probability of roof replacement or edge-thinning and end ladder replacement) to help fill this huge gap in the market, though unfortunately I don't think it'll be the fleet car it could've/should've been. This is where I am with models that are important to my modeling plans but may have some shortcomings. In this case, I have some spare parts (like Cannon / Athearn P-S roofs) that I’ll use to upgrade features that I’m not satisfied with, if needed. These Plate B PS box cars are such a “signature” car in the CSX box car fleet that I have to have them though. In reference to the Walthers ACF 5090, I think it has “good bones,” as I believe Liz Allen says, in that if you want to put forth the effort, the basic dimensions will produce a good model (with lots of carving off molded parts and adding separate details). The underbody is actually pretty detailed with a separate plastic brake rigging assembly that represents most of the parts on the prototype. However, I can probably only do that once, and I need a bunch of those 5090s. It will be along time before we see a more detail model of that prototype, if ever. In the same vein, I’m going to have to use this PS model, even if some of the details don’t turn out as good as I’d like. Dave
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Post by csx3305 on Oct 25, 2018 17:46:46 GMT -8
Studying my 4/92 ORER I see that there is a whopping total of 11 cars called out in the SBD series that NARC is offering. Exactly none of the 11 match the NARC numbers however a few are immediately adjacent. What this seems to imply is that all of the SBD numbers offered by NARC were patched CSXT by 4/92.
The B&O-Chessies fare quite a bit better, with all but one NARC roadnumber called out specifically in the 4/92 ORER. Tempted to get a few if I can turn up good pics to work from. Will search on that in a few minutes.
The Southern 14xxx series as displayed by NARC is completely nonexistant in my ORER....lowest boxcar starts at 15000 and then up from there. Didn't NS sell these cars off to WC/SSAM circa 1990? Or was that another group of ex-RBOX cars?
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Post by csx3305 on Oct 25, 2018 18:02:59 GMT -8
Also bears pointing out that four of the CSXT roadnumbers that NARC is offering is called out in my Register. So allow me to clear something up.... Mr. Sawyer, are the roadnumbers that you have listed confirmed to be 1996 repaints? Reading your reply to my initial question seems to imply that perhaps 7/96 is appearing on the artwork for one car and is just being repeated across the entire 6 pack, changing only the roadnumber? Or is each car's specific artwork based on its exact prototype?Disregard the question.....cough, ahem......i'll just leave this here: www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=510179Here we have one car that is still in its original RBOX paint a decade after it was implied to have been repainted into CSX. Quite clear that the artwork was prepared for one car and is being repeated across the six pack, changing only the roadnumber. To that end, repaint dates are almost meaningless IMHO and it is trivial at best to call this information out to customers to begin with. Especially in regard to a railroad like CSX which was never, ever consistent in its repainted lettering. Just as well to order a few cars and change the numbers/redecal to match photos of cars known to be repainted prior to my 1993 cutoff date.
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Post by csxt8400 on Oct 25, 2018 18:49:40 GMT -8
Well, that kinda sucks..
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Post by fcixdarrell on Oct 25, 2018 20:58:16 GMT -8
Also bears pointing out that four of the CSXT roadnumbers that NARC is offering is called out in my Register. So allow me to clear something up.... Mr. Sawyer, are the roadnumbers that you have listed confirmed to be 1996 repaints? Reading your reply to my initial question seems to imply that perhaps 7/96 is appearing on the artwork for one car and is just being repeated across the entire 6 pack, changing only the roadnumber? Or is each car's specific artwork based on its exact prototype?Disregard the question.....cough, ahem......i'll just leave this here: www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=510179Here we have one car that is still in its original RBOX paint a decade after it was implied to have been repainted into CSX. Quite clear that the artwork was prepared for one car and is being repeated across the six pack, changing only the roadnumber. To that end, repaint dates are almost meaningless IMHO and it is trivial at best to call this information out to customers to begin with. Especially in regard to a railroad like CSX which was never, ever consistent in its repainted lettering. Just as well to order a few cars and change the numbers/redecal to match photos of cars known to be repainted prior to my 1993 cutoff date. Dave Olsen kindly pointed out that one of the CSX numbers chosen indeed was still in patched RBOX paint in 2007 and offered a couple of numbers/photographs to use instead. The list of available on the artwork has been corrected for the factory to work with. The web site will be updated to show the new number (141416). There's obviously a disconnect between how things work in reality artwork-wise and potential customers impressions. For each paint scheme run, there is a setup fee for the tampo plates for the pad printer. The fee varies based on how many colors are incorporated and if masks are required. For example, the Southern RBOX patched car has 8 colors in total (6 of which are used on tampo plates) and at least one mask (separate fee) for the black door and possibly one for the roof (it's a separate part so may be painted separately). Each color sprayed on the body is also a separate charge. Each step takes labor and materials, so the fees are fair. The more colors, the higher the cost. Road numbers are all we can change on a paint scheme without it becoming an artwork change and requiring a new charge all over again. I am trying to get them to change the "R" and "L" that is to the left of the door on most paint schemes. Plus, some cars have notes like "defect card" or "retaining valve", etc. on only one side of the car, but the samples have the same thing on both sides regardless of the artwork supplied. The minimum per paint scheme is something like 288 cars in HO, 6 road numbers, 48 of each number. The minimum run is 1000 cars. You are correct, the artwork was prepared for one road number and repeated across the six pack. This is how it works for everybody (Atlas, Athearn, Intermountain, etc.). In order to do separate detail lettering like load limit, light weight, reweigh date (if applicable) paint date, COTS data, etc., the decoration costs would be 6 times greater which would increase the retail price of each car. It would be great if it could be done, but the technology is not to that point, yet. Are the paint dates on the numbers chosen confirmed to be from 1996? Nope. We tried, but like most everyone else, we had to rely on online images (plus help from folks we know that have images of the cars we are doing) and in most cases the 1" tall paint date and code below the consolidated panel just isn't legible. We've tried to be as accurate as possible, within reason. Probably 95% of PWRS's customers are not rivet counter types and don't give a crap if CSX (or their favorite road) had a PS 5077 on their roster. They only car if it is painted for their favorite road, and don't care if the paint scheme is accurate or not. They are concerned with a car that runs good, the lettering is crisp and it's their road. Most can't tell the difference between an ACF 5095, an FMC 5077, a PCF 5077 or a PS 5077 and think they all look alike. But, we are trying to cater to the 5% that do care and can tell the differences between them. But, we still have to keep prices comparable to what the other companies are selling similar cars at. PWRS doesn't put fake paint schemes on their replicas just to sell more, and typically spend a lot more on tooling yet still keep their prices reasonable (well, all cars and locos are getting too expensive, but that's a different topic all together). They can offer a variety of versions of each car at a decent price because they went the direct-to-consumer route and eliminated the distributor's and retailer's cut. If they went the brick and mortar route, these cars would retail in the $60-70 US range, which would be unreasonable. For future projects, I will suggest that they don't go into as much detail on their web site about each version or paint scheme. I hope this helps folks understand the limitations that we have to work with, decoration-wise, and why choices are made they way they are. Thanks for your time. Darrell Sawyer
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Post by csx3305 on Oct 25, 2018 22:08:13 GMT -8
You are correct, the artwork was prepared for one road number and repeated across the six pack. This is how it works for everybody (Atlas, Athearn, Intermountain, etc.). In order to do separate detail lettering like load limit, light weight, reweigh date (if applicable) paint date, COTS data, etc., the decoration costs would be 6 times greater which would increase the retail price of each car. It would be great if it could be done, but the technology is not to that point, yet. Are the paint dates on the numbers chosen confirmed to be from 1996? Nope. We tried, but like most everyone else, we had to rely on online images (plus help from folks we know that have images of the cars we are doing) and in most cases the 1" tall paint date and code below the consolidated panel just isn't legible. We've tried to be as accurate as possible, within reason. Probably 95% of PWRS's customers are not rivet counter types and don't give a crap if CSX (or their favorite road) had a PS 5077 on their roster. They only car if it is painted for their favorite road, and don't care if the paint scheme is accurate or not. They are concerned with a car that runs good, the lettering is crisp and it's their road. Most can't tell the difference between an ACF 5095, an FMC 5077, a PCF 5077 or a PS 5077 and think they all look alike. But, we are trying to cater to the 5% that do care and can tell the differences between them. But, we still have to keep prices comparable to what the other companies are selling similar cars at. PWRS doesn't put fake paint schemes on their replicas just to sell more, and typically spend a lot more on tooling yet still keep their prices reasonable (well, all cars and locos are getting too expensive, but that's a different topic all together). They can offer a variety of versions of each car at a decent price because they went the direct-to-consumer route and eliminated the distributor's and retailer's cut. If they went the brick and mortar route, these cars would retail in the $60-70 US range, which would be unreasonable. Meh.....Tangent and Scaletrains seem to be doing a bang-up job of it, at roughly only a ten percent and twenty percent price increase per car,respectively, over this NARC offering. See the Airslides from both companies for just one shining example. I have seen both cars in brick and mortar shops, BTW. I don't doubt you on your 95 percent comment, but in this context it just comes across as a copout and IMO negates the whole point of tooling up so many detail variations. Why is NARC building a proverbial Rolls Royce only to have Earl Scheib paint it? And lastly, you're (or rather, whoever is calling the shots on this project is) missing the point I'm trying to make. By superimposing a built date across random repainted cars whose numbers are pulled from websurfing sessions, NARC is INDEED, in effect, making fake paint schemes. Given the link I posted above, it even appears that at least one of the CSXT roadnumbers were chosen at random, without any research. Whatever, I guess. May just spend the nest egg I was putting back for these cars on more Airslides. Thank you for your responses.
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Post by stottman on Oct 26, 2018 6:02:38 GMT -8
In reference to the Walthers ACF 5090, I think it has “good bones,” as I believe Liz Allen says, in that if you want to put forth the effort, the basic dimensions will produce a good model (with lots of carving off molded parts and adding separate details). The underbody is actually pretty detailed with a separate plastic brake rigging assembly that represents most of the parts on the prototype. However, I can probably only do that once, and I need a bunch of those 5090s. Dave As I finally start to plug away at my freight car projects, I am starting to wonder if all those small details that are absent are often worth the bother. Are seperate door tracks really an improvement if they are still oversized, have a huge seam from being multiple pieces, and installed crooked at the factory?
Are seperate ladders really an improvement if they are still oversized, are made from pre-broken crystal, and can barely survive the process involved in dullcoteing and kyloning the car? ANd no replacements are available, and even if there were, good luck matching the paint.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Oct 26, 2018 6:53:45 GMT -8
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Post by hovehicle on Oct 26, 2018 7:17:26 GMT -8
After all of the negative comments about these boxcars I will still order 4 bars of soap painted for CP Rail and WC. Hey, at least the Kadee couplers are worth something!
For all the naysayers, please start your own company and I can't wait to judge your first freight car project in HO. I'm sure it won't even be close to being perfect.
All I can say is wow.
Vito L.
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Post by riogrande on Oct 26, 2018 7:34:36 GMT -8
It's been interesting reading all the hew and cry over these PWRS box cars. Are these box cars looking at next spring/summer for delivery now?
Hopefully improvements will be made - I may still be in for one or two such as a PC and maybe a Railbox.
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Post by delta767332er on Oct 26, 2018 8:07:28 GMT -8
Also bears pointing out that four of the CSXT roadnumbers that NARC is offering is called out in my Register. So allow me to clear something up.... Mr. Sawyer, are the roadnumbers that you have listed confirmed to be 1996 repaints? Reading your reply to my initial question seems to imply that perhaps 7/96 is appearing on the artwork for one car and is just being repeated across the entire 6 pack, changing only the roadnumber? Or is each car's specific artwork based on its exact prototype?Disregard the question.....cough, ahem......i'll just leave this here: www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=510179Here we have one car that is still in its original RBOX paint a decade after it was implied to have been repainted into CSX. Quite clear that the artwork was prepared for one car and is being repeated across the six pack, changing only the roadnumber. To that end, repaint dates are almost meaningless IMHO and it is trivial at best to call this information out to customers to begin with. Especially in regard to a railroad like CSX which was never, ever consistent in its repainted lettering. Just as well to order a few cars and change the numbers/redecal to match photos of cars known to be repainted prior to my 1993 cutoff date. This is exactly the kind of stuff I was trying to prevent when I attempted to offer assistance with the artwork. I lost interest when my first few hours of research was responded to by crickets. As you can tell from the response you got, those making decisions at PWRS (this is not directed at Darrell) are striving very hard to be very average. In 10 minutes, I could’ve (did) come up with long lists of car numbers that would’ve been more appropriate for this CSX scheme, or any other repaints. Taking a few moments to check rrpa/ff/rcp/ORERs to make sure car number selections check out isn’t difficult or time-consuming. They just don’t care to. It takes about as long as making a post of excuses of why you didn’t.
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Post by delta767332er on Oct 26, 2018 8:18:18 GMT -8
After all of the negative comments about these boxcars I will still order 4 bars of soap painted for CP Rail and WC. Hey, at least the Kadee couplers are worth something! For all the naysayers, please start your own company and I can't wait to judge your first freight car project in HO. I'm sure it won't even be close to being perfect. All I can say is wow. Vito L. This tired strawman argument is so empty and futile. If you hire a plumber and he does a sloppy, subpar job, while your neighbor’s plumber is a professional striving for perfection while charging the same price, do you expect him to say “go start your own plumbing company” when you complain about the work? Or when your mower starts falling apart 2 weeks after you buy it, you’re A-OK with the salesman suggesting you start your own manufacturing company. These excuses for lack of research, knowledge, or QA in the process died when some people started doing things right. Maybe not perfect, but striving for perfection. If one company can do it right, everyone else can. This isn’t that subjective. Oh, it’s just model trains, you say? You must pay for your bars of soap with Monopoly money.
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Post by delta767332er on Oct 26, 2018 8:23:59 GMT -8
This is how it works for everybody (Atlas, Athearn, Intermountain, etc.). Like Ed said: WRONG!
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Post by csx3305 on Oct 26, 2018 9:17:08 GMT -8
After all of the negative comments about these boxcars I will still order 4 bars of soap painted for CP Rail and WC. Hey, at least the Kadee couplers are worth something! For all the naysayers, please start your own company and I can't wait to judge your first freight car project in HO. I'm sure it won't even be close to being perfect. All I can say is wow. Vito L. This tired strawman argument is so empty and futile. If you hire a plumber and he does a sloppy, subpar job, while your neighbor’s plumber is a professional striving for perfection while charging the same price, do you expect him to say “go start your own plumbing company” when you complain about the work? Or when your mower starts falling apart 2 weeks after you buy it, you’re A-OK with the salesman suggesting you start your own manufacturing company. These excuses for lack of research, knowledge, or QA in the process died when some people started doing things right. Maybe not perfect, but striving for perfection. If one company can do it right, everyone else can. This isn’t that subjective. Oh, it’s just model trains, you say? You must pay for your bars of soap with Monopoly money. It’s really comical when you glance through his recent posts about wavy and leaning handrails on diesels. Interesting how leaning handrails is a legitimate concern but foobie paint schemes and catch all lettering on a badly needed prototype is nothing more than whining nitpickers fuel....... D$*n shame these couldn’t get better treatment, they are/were an interesting and substantial part of the CSX boxcar fleet. I would’ve paid 60 per if they had knocked it out of the park. Oh well.
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Post by hovehicle on Oct 26, 2018 10:52:24 GMT -8
csx3305,
Remember, you're part of the 5% of nit-pickers who will make an ass out of themselves just to make a point on artwork. Did NARC offer these up in Western Maryland or FEC? No, they didn't. You MAKE IT SEEM LIKE THEY DO IT ON PURPOSE if they get one little detail off as far as artwork. Thank God most of us are in the 95% because we would NOT have a train hobby period with so much negativity. It's comical how lame you are with your bashing of NARC and now me.
Vito L.
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Post by csx3305 on Oct 26, 2018 12:21:01 GMT -8
For those who might be following along quietly: www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3143660www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3743084www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1260165Should illustrate that it’s not just a matter of “one little detail off”. Might not be as jarring as crooked handrails or absence of ditchlights to some. But let it be known we are not talking about a tiny one inch tall repaint date being a dealbreaker here. It’s a matter of font, size, placement, color,etc. on all major lettering. Lots of variations in the CSX freight cars over the years. You can’t take CSX repainted boxcars from 1989, 1996, and 2013 and expect them to all be the same. They will be blue with yellow lettering but that’s about where the similarities will end. The roadname font changed at least once, placement changed multiple times, and earlier cars favored the 36” tall roadname lettering. Data placement and reporting mark placement changed as well. Sometimes higher or lower, sometimes it jumped left or right a panel. So to do artwork on one car and then randomly substitute other roadnumbers, there’s going to be errors.
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Post by drolsen on Oct 26, 2018 14:37:21 GMT -8
I get your point, and I’m with you, but you also can’t take contemporary photos of three cars and use those to say that the paint jobs they each wore in 1996 were different. The photo of CSXT 141421 that you posted shows its more recent (probably second) CSX repaint. Here’s what it looked like in 2009, wearing what was probably a ‘90s paint job, with the size and placement of the reporting marks matching the other two cars: www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1483625My photo of CSXT 141306 that you posted shows the car number patched because of graffiti, probably in the last 2 years or so before the photo. Again, not what it would have looked like if it was painted in 1996. 141430 shows a lettering job very close, if not identical to 141306, including the vertical placement on the car sides, the location of the CSX Quality Car logo, and the style of the medium-sized CSX logo. Now, the issue I see is that the reporting mark font may be a bit too large, and the “CS” and “XT” should be centered in their panels on the model to match those prototypes. That may be an adjustment that they can still make. I don’t recall what year the Quality Car lettering was applied, although I think it was early ‘90s - hopefully one of you could answer that. I personally don’t expect a manufacturer to confirm that every car was painted in 1996. That’s something we haven’t seen manufacturers do until recently, and that’s only a select group of manufacturers are doing. Intermountain and ExactRail certainly aren’t doing that as they crank out a dozen car numbers at a time. I’ve noticed that a lot of ExactRail’s ABOX repaint numbers were still wearing their original paint in the recent photos I checked online. I believe the same thing happened when I looked through their patched-out DRGW quad hopper numbers. I didn’t buy any of those numbers. However, when prototype photos are available, I do want to see the lettering placement and font size match the model for the numbers that are selected. But they all may not have been painted in 1996. From talking to Dan, he plans to do different repaint years on subsequent runs and also vary the shade of CSX blue a bit to represent different paint batches. Dave
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