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Post by rhammill on Jan 17, 2020 12:53:40 GMT -8
Hi, all - As you probably know, we have launched our first Project. We're crowd funding this, and we're offering a special discount for members of the forum. We're making 17 different prototypes, all to be released in early 2021 if we reach our funding goal. They will built to order, so you can get RTR, decorated or undecorated kits, and parts will also be available. The main prototypes are: ATSF Bx-11, -12, and -12 single sheathed box cars, including those rebuilt with 8" and 12" roof extensions, all the way to all three classes being rebuild with steel sides. RI Pratt truss single sheathed box car, which is similar to the ATSF cars, but with a number of differences in the design. We're also doing Pratt truss single sheathed auto cars for CGW, L&N, PM (later lettered for C&O). Many of the PM cars (also later lettered for C&O) were rebuilt into single door box cars. These prototypes were built 1929-1931, and ran into the '60s, and some into the '70s. SRP for RTR and kits is $50. Decorated kits will include the full sprues that have parts for a specific prototype, which means you'll receive extra parts. There are three base kits, and the undecorated kits come with all of the sprues for that base kit. So lots of extra parts. None of the auto cars have been produced in any form, plastic, resin, or brass, in HO scale. Dalman One-Level trucks, several roofs and ends that have not been available in plastic, all sorts of things for people who like to make kits. Some of the ATSF cars have been produced in resin by Westerfield, and the RI cars in resin by Sunshine. Go here for the full details, along with the special 20% discount available for members of the forum.We know this is a new way of doing things, so please contact us with any questions or concerns. We think that kits and parts are still an important part of the hobby, and want to be able to provide that for this and future projects. Come see us at the Springfield Show, Better Living Center 25-G, and join us in this project and let's make some models! Thanks - Randy — Randy Hammill Prototype Junction prototypejunction.comModeling the New Haven Railroad 1946-1954 newbritainstation.com
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Post by valenciajim on Jan 17, 2020 15:15:59 GMT -8
When I click on the link, I get a blank page. I clicked on the link to your business and that worked. This sounds interesting. How many forum members are interested in participating in the crowd funding?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2020 15:58:47 GMT -8
I just clicked on the IndieGoGo link to the special offer and it worked fine for me.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2020 17:38:40 GMT -8
You may consider having a QR code on a sign/poster/LED screen at the show so people can instantly go to this site while at the show on their phones and pledge money.
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Post by valenciajim on Jan 20, 2020 16:44:52 GMT -8
So, to date, it seems like there are a total of 77 backers who have committed to 4% of the goal. I have developed a fascination with ATSF box cars in recent weeks-even those that are outside my era. So these intrigued me. Good luck and I hope these get produced.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Jan 20, 2020 18:28:18 GMT -8
I'll happily pay list price when I can see a physical sample for me to buy.
Ed
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Post by westerntrains on Jan 20, 2020 19:39:01 GMT -8
I'll happily pay list price when I can see a physical sample for me to buy. Ed Amen. Too many announcements in the past for models that never materialize. Too many manufactures and dealers that have run off with peoples money. If they have faith they can produce the model,let them invest their money. If they build a model I will buy, but I won't invest money in a non existant model.
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Post by csx3305 on Jan 20, 2020 21:09:27 GMT -8
They’d probably look good running up shermanhill.
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Post by simulatortrain on Jan 21, 2020 5:51:46 GMT -8
Any newer photos of the steel rebuilt cars you can share? I'm out unless I can see them in the 70s. That said, I would be much more receptive to something like a Bx-85.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2020 6:14:47 GMT -8
I haven’t seen anything from this company on any of the Facebook groups, magazines, etc. If they really want to get to that goal they will market more aggressively into a broader audience.
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Post by SOMECALLMETIM on Jan 21, 2020 7:44:46 GMT -8
ATSF steel Bx-11 and Bx-12 rebuilds didn't make it past 1976 - unless you include the ones that were rebuilt again in early 1960s to Bx-85 and Bx-86 cars. Both are pretty cool - Bx-86 had the corrugated sides. These two series lasted until 1982 I believe. I would pick up either a Bx-85 or Bx-86 car. Any newer photos of the steel rebuilt cars you can share? I'm out unless I can see them in the 70s. That said, I would be much more receptive to something like a Bx-85.
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Post by simulatortrain on Jan 21, 2020 8:22:06 GMT -8
ATSF steel Bx-11 and Bx-12 rebuilds didn't make it past 1976 - unless you include the ones that were rebuilt again in early 1960s to Bx-85 and Bx-86 cars. Both are pretty cool - Bx-86 had the corrugated sides. These two series lasted until 1982 I believe. I would pick up either a Bx-85 or Bx-86 car. Any newer photos of the steel rebuilt cars you can share? I'm out unless I can see them in the 70s. That said, I would be much more receptive to something like a Bx-85. Thanks for the info. I'm in 1975, so theoretically I could run one. Still, I'm with you in favor of the Bx-85/Bx-86. I'm sure they are included in the other versions that could be tooled if the project is funded beyond the goal, but I think I'd have to see them in the initial offering to pledge. Basically no need for wood cars here. Randy, sell me on a kit. Is it as simple as putting plug doors on the steel rebuilt car?
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Post by mdvle on Jan 22, 2020 15:46:59 GMT -8
For anyone interested Randy participated in a podcast where he discusses Prototype Junction and the choice of prototypes. He, along with Jim Lincoln, are guests on Mike Rose's podcast. The first 35 minutes are introduction and some general discussion, then they discuss the crowd funding project. Crew Call
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Post by champagnetrail on Jan 23, 2020 14:09:23 GMT -8
ATSF steel Bx-11 and Bx-12 rebuilds didn't make it past 1976 - unless you include the ones that were rebuilt again in early 1960s to Bx-85 and Bx-86 cars. Both are pretty cool - Bx-86 had the corrugated sides. These two series lasted until 1982 I believe. I would pick up either a Bx-85 or Bx-86 car. Thanks for the info. I'm in 1975, so theoretically I could run one. Still, I'm with you in favor of the Bx-85/Bx-86. I'm sure they are included in the other versions that could be tooled if the project is funded beyond the goal, but I think I'd have to see them in the initial offering to pledge. Basically no need for wood cars here. Randy, sell me on a kit. Is it as simple as putting plug doors on the steel rebuilt car? As noted in the other thread about these cars, I've got two of them that show up in the EL wheel report collection in early 1976. So, I think the Bx-12 rebuilds would work for you if you model 1975. They were still running to the East Coast into 1976.
-pat
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Post by rhammill on Jan 27, 2020 19:55:43 GMT -8
ATSF steel Bx-11 and Bx-12 rebuilds didn't make it past 1976 - unless you include the ones that were rebuilt again in early 1960s to Bx-85 and Bx-86 cars. Both are pretty cool - Bx-86 had the corrugated sides. These two series lasted until 1982 I believe. I would pick up either a Bx-85 or Bx-86 car. Thanks for the info. I'm in 1975, so theoretically I could run one. Still, I'm with you in favor of the Bx-85/Bx-86. I'm sure they are included in the other versions that could be tooled if the project is funded beyond the goal, but I think I'd have to see them in the initial offering to pledge. Basically no need for wood cars here. Randy, sell me on a kit. Is it as simple as putting plug doors on the steel rebuilt car? Unfortunately, you'd have to do some significant modifications to do them. The dimensions would be correct, and many of the details, but the sides wouldn't be. They had an 8' door opening rather than the 6' door, which also means the panel spacing is different. So you'd have to widen the door opening, sand off the panel lines, and user Archer rivets and a door sourced from somewhere. Finding the door would probably be the hardest part. Instead of going to all that trouble, though, why don't we just consider adding it to the project? We have to fund the project first, but we've already priced the tooling for additional variations like this one. It would add about $25,000 to the total cost of the project. In other words, a $275,000 total. So we need to get to the initial $250,000 and then we'll have plenty of time to work on building additional orders to do things like the Bx-85, -86, or perhaps the PM stock cars. That's kind of the point of what we're trying to accomplish - that the Backers help determine the course of the project. I can't guarantee that the Bx-85 would be the car that everybody would select if we have the opportunity to do more than just the variations announced. But those are definitely within the potential scope of the project. Hopefully we'll raise enough that we can do all three of those variations, and maybe more. Randy — Randy Hammill Prototype Junction prototypejunction.comModeling the New Haven Railroad 1946-1954 newbritainstation.com
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Post by rhammill on Jan 27, 2020 20:02:11 GMT -8
I'll happily pay list price when I can see a physical sample for me to buy. Ed Amen. Too many announcements in the past for models that never materialize. Too many manufactures and dealers that have run off with peoples money. If they have faith they can produce the model,let them invest their money. If they build a model I will buy, but I won't invest money in a non existant model. We totally understand that sentiment, and that's fine. If I had $250,000 to invest I'd do it. We don't so if we want to produce the models, we have to find an alternative way to do it. There is a difference between a dealer deposit and the process we're using, though. First, the deposit is going directly to funding the project, rather than to guarantee that you'll pick up the model from the dealer you ordered it from. Dealer deposits aren't passed onto the manufacturer, so don't help get the project produced. In addition, we're not moving forward unless we fully fund the project. So many have failed because the company runs out of money before the model is produced, and that's specifically one of the hurdles we want to eliminate through this approach. Regardless, you have to do what you're comfortable with, and you're welcome to wait until the physical models are available for your inspection. It's still very helpful for you to spread the word to your modeling buddies to let them decide if supporting our project is something they want to do, which ultimately benefits you too if it allows us to make a model that you do eventually want to buy. Food for thought. Thanks for the input! Randy — Randy Hammill Prototype Junction prototypejunction.comModeling the New Haven Railroad 1946-1954 newbritainstation.com
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Post by rhammill on Jan 27, 2020 20:11:09 GMT -8
Any newer photos of the steel rebuilt cars you can share? I'm out unless I can see them in the 70s. That said, I would be much more receptive to something like a Bx-85. I don't think we have anything else we have permission to share. But I can give you quantities from the live lists: All three classes lasted until 1974, when there were 261 Bx-11s, 98 Bx-12s, and 114 Bx-13s in the configuration in the project. It appears they were all gone by '75. Randy — Randy Hammill Prototype Junction prototypejunction.comModeling the New Haven Railroad 1946-1954 newbritainstation.comRead more: atlasrescueforum.proboards.com/post/133333/quote/7967#ixzz6CIHi6sKL
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jan 27, 2020 20:54:35 GMT -8
So is Trueline Trains officially kaput?
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Post by mdvle on Jan 28, 2020 7:14:13 GMT -8
So is Trueline Trains officially kaput?
Randy covered this somewhere, basically not yet but he doesn't really know what the plans are. Trueline Trains is Darren's company and so far doesn't seem to have officially closed.
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Post by stevewagner on Jan 28, 2020 9:11:23 GMT -8
At the show in West Springfield last Saturday Randy Hammill showed me a casting as a sample of the quality of the work done by the same factory that Prototype Junction plans to have make their models, if they reach their funding goals. I immediately recognized it as the body for the modern (according to my use of that term) steel CN caboose that was, I'm pretty sure, the last new model that True Line Trains actually brought to market.
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Post by valenciajim on Jan 29, 2020 22:01:52 GMT -8
With ten days left, they have only raised 6% of their goal. This is not looking too promising at this point.
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Post by sd40dash2 on Jan 30, 2020 3:17:33 GMT -8
With ten days left, they have only raised 6% of their goal. This is not looking too promising at this point. I suspect too many people in the hobby have been burned with similar types of "pay well in advance" arrangements in the past and don't want to be burned again. We've all heard the stories and the passage of time doesn't put the lost money back in our pockets.
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Post by schroed2 on Jan 30, 2020 6:23:59 GMT -8
well, I had thought about this, but the only car on the list that I could really use in 1969 would be the Bx11/12 w raised roof and I have a Westerfield kit for this in the stash...
If there would be some real commitment to the Bx85/86, things might be different...
Bernd Adelsdorf, Germany
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Post by Colin 't Hart on Jan 30, 2020 8:14:24 GMT -8
With ten days left, they have only raised 6% of their goal. This is not looking too promising at this point. I suspect too many people in the hobby have been burned with similar types of "pay well in advance" arrangements in the past and don't want to be burned again. We've all heard the stories and the passage of time doesn't put the lost money back in our pockets. That. And they're looking to raise a quarter of a million dollars in 30 days. At $50 each (which puts them at the higher end of the RTR boxcar market with prices between those of Tangent and Moloco), they would need to sell a cool 5000 units... I think they're extremely out of touch with reality.
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Post by simulatortrain on Jan 30, 2020 8:55:46 GMT -8
And I think that's the reason we don't see many niche cars in plastic. It's a fine idea, but good luck finding the ones with enough demand to make it happen. Perhaps a survey could have helped steer the selections in the right direction, even within the cars in this proposal vs. those mentioned for overfunding.
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Post by Christian on Jan 30, 2020 9:38:36 GMT -8
And I think that's the reason we don't see many niche cars in plastic. It's a fine idea, but good luck finding the ones with enough demand to make it happen. Perhaps a survey could have helped steer the selections in the right direction, even within the cars in this proposal vs. those mentioned for overfunding. Santa Fe fans are fanatics about their boxcars. So this would be a safe bet if this was 1990 when the press was flogging post-WWI boxcar development and modelers in this era were getting lots of press. I don't know if there are numbers of steam modelers remaining that would support this sort of approach in state of the art plastic. Resin kit makers of this era are also dwindling. It appears that the current sweet modeling spot is the 1980's and these cars would not be a factor even though there were a few survivors.
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Post by simulatortrain on Jan 30, 2020 11:17:12 GMT -8
And I think that's the reason we don't see many niche cars in plastic. It's a fine idea, but good luck finding the ones with enough demand to make it happen. Perhaps a survey could have helped steer the selections in the right direction, even within the cars in this proposal vs. those mentioned for overfunding. Santa Fe fans are fanatics about their boxcars. So this would be a safe bet if this was 1990 when the press was flogging post-WWI boxcar development and modelers in this era were getting lots of press. I don't know if there are numbers of steam modelers remaining that would support this sort of approach in state of the art plastic. Resin kit makers of this era are also dwindling. It appears that the current sweet modeling spot is the 1980's and these cars would not be a factor even though there were a few survivors. I agree, except for the resin comment. It seems to me the majority of resin operations are still doing steam- or transition-era cars. That's not to imply that some aren't cars that lasted beyond and are suitable for later modelers as well. However, I don't know how many people there were doing resin kits a few decades ago and which ones are no longer doing so for whatever reason. Could certainly be more than I'm aware of. Regardless, it's a great time to model the 60s-80s!
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Post by edwardsutorik on Jan 30, 2020 12:21:02 GMT -8
Yeah, it's pretty clear that old cars won't sell. Take, for example, a Northern Pacific wood-side boxcar. Nobody wants those.
Ed
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Post by riogrande on Jan 30, 2020 12:30:48 GMT -8
Yeah, it's pretty clear that old cars won't sell. Take, for example, a Northern Pacific wood-side boxcar. Nobody wants those. Ed Like the ones Rapido made?
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Post by Christian on Jan 30, 2020 12:45:20 GMT -8
Yeah, it's pretty clear that old cars won't sell. Take, for example, a Northern Pacific wood-side boxcar. Nobody wants those. Ed Good point. Atlas, Athearn, Walthers, and Tangent are also flogging post-WWI cars. But I still support my argument that a niche Santa Fe boxcar has a limited though fanatical audience that is getting older minute by minute.
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