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Post by steveturner on Sept 28, 2012 22:13:35 GMT -8
Looking for ideas how to mount a can motor. I dont want to use silicone. I want tobe able to take it apart. Any thoughts on a bracket and what tomake one with would be appreciated. I believe the motor comes with 2 screws.Steve
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Post by el3637 on Sept 29, 2012 0:22:04 GMT -8
What motor, in what?
Andy
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2012 3:54:16 GMT -8
Most motors mount with four screws. Athearn, Kato, Intermountain, Walthers Proto, Bowser, OMI Brass to name just a few, all use a four screw system.
The motor can torque and twist on two mounts. Four is keeps the motor from twisting under load.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Sept 29, 2012 7:19:24 GMT -8
I've got some can motors with two threaded holes in each end-cap. I made the appropriate brackets.
But if you're talking about just a can with no mounting holes at all, I made a mount where there was a bedding plate and a two piece strap that went over the top. Each piece accounted for 90 degrees of the motor circumference. At the top I placed a (very small) bolt connection and tightened the strap pieces together. You could probably do it with just one strap over the whole top. I used screws to hold down the ends of the strap, and these could have been used to tighten the strap instead of the top bolt. All the pieces were made of brass.
Ed
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Post by steveturner on Sept 29, 2012 7:39:35 GMT -8
Sorry i should have been more specific. A mdc Shay though for all purposes flat surface. I assume the two screws that come with a NWSL older sagami can motor maybe for two screw holes that maybe on front of motor?Steve
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Post by edwardsutorik on Sept 29, 2012 9:25:48 GMT -8
Sorry i should have been more specific. A mdc Shay though for all purposes flat surface. I assume the two screws that come with a NWSL older sagami can motor maybe for two screw holes that maybe on front of motor?Steve Looks like your choice is making a mounting bracket and using the two-screw mounting or building a cradle system as I described above. Another option is to silicon the motor to a plate that is screwed down to the frame. You do use the silicon method, but it fits your removability requirement. I'd seriously think about that method based on its "easiness". About the only time you'd want to remove the motor from the mounting plate itself is when it's dead. And then you won't be too worried about damaging the motor. Or you can just make a new mounting plate for the new motor. Ed |
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Post by steveturner on Sept 29, 2012 10:58:23 GMT -8
I like the idea of neatly silconing motor to a plate and screwing plate to flat surface.I guess you could also glue a couple of strips of styrene to plate to cradle motor nicely for siliconing.I have read where silcone acts as a viabration damper and allows for any torque. Thnks for the ideas .Steve.....................fall winter project build my second Shay. Have all the brass etc and NWSL parts. My first runs to perfection, the icing on the cake was the paint. MDC Shay project is really a work piece you dont want to part with ! Steve................the motor in 1st Shay came with mounting bracket.
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Post by atsfan on Sept 30, 2012 5:30:31 GMT -8
nwsl.com/uploads/cat_chap2_for_web_9-20.pdfEven this shows silicon in a shay. How often do you want to take it apart? Unless often, use silicon and then if ever needed slice the motor out of it. When finished pull off all the old silicon and replace it.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Sept 30, 2012 10:20:09 GMT -8
nwsl.com/uploads/cat_chap2_for_web_9-20.pdfEven this shows silicon in a shay. How often do you want to take it apart? Unless often, use silicon and then if ever needed slice the motor out of it. When finished pull off all the old silicon and replace it. If'n I had that Shay (or likely other ones), I'd NEVER mount the motor that way--just siliconed in. If you put it on a brass plate first, you can adjust the gear mesh. If you just glue it in, you are depending on getting it just right by just mooshing the motor into the silicon. I don't have a lot of confidence in my mooshing ability--maybe if I practiced a lot, first? Ed |
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Post by Donnell Wells on Sept 30, 2012 20:50:37 GMT -8
Looking for ideas how to mount a can motor. I dont want to use silicone. I want tobe able to take it apart. Any thoughts on a bracket and what tomake one with would be appreciated. I believe the motor comes with 2 screws.Steve
It's funny that you bring this up, as I am trying to figure out a way to mount an Igarashi motor (with custom hew flywheels I hadd made last year) into an Athearn F59PHI. I have a few ideas, but none have come to full fruition, thus I don't have much to show.
Here's the motor:
I just need to find a way to secureit in the chassis.
Donnell |
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Post by craigz on Oct 1, 2012 9:51:58 GMT -8
Silicone, Donnell. Silicone. For years I've been using styrene to build a cradle to get the motor shaft up to the same level as the worm shafts and applying a bead of RTV Silicone down either side. Won't move, won't come loose, and let be realistic - how many times have you had to actually take a motor back out? I've never had to pull one back out.
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Post by atsfan on Oct 2, 2012 5:53:02 GMT -8
I don't know when you would need to remove a motor?
If you really feel that way then use silicon and imbed in it a small worm clamp or similar way to strap the engine down on it.
Or drill hose in the bottom and route wire straps through them and around them motor?
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Post by nebrzephyr on Oct 2, 2012 12:55:21 GMT -8
Donnell......interested in hearing more about the "cradle" under the motor in your photo.
Bob
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Post by Donnell Wells on Oct 2, 2012 23:54:02 GMT -8
The cradle under the motor was one of my early test designs. It measures .750" x 1.250" x .040" and has two side rails .080" x .100" x 1.250" that form the cradle. I placed a piece of .750" wide double side tape (from Harbor Freight @ $1.99) in the cradle to see if if would successfully hold the motor. I haven't actually tested it yet, but I have since designed another cradle that is similar, but will be machined to its final dimensions.
Donnell
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Post by nebrzephyr on Oct 3, 2012 5:38:42 GMT -8
Donnell....thanks for the specifics on the "cradle". There are more than a few of us who re-motor Athearn units. And I think Athearn's "4 hole" mounting is pretty standard (dimension wise) in most of it's RTR diesels. So, you may have a "market" for such a part if you come up with a design that works.
Bob
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pappy
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Post by pappy on Oct 3, 2012 7:03:45 GMT -8
I just need to find a way to secureit in the chassis. Donnell [/font][/quote] Could you use 2 or 3 very small zip ties with that chassis? |
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Post by Donnell Wells on Oct 3, 2012 11:34:25 GMT -8
Basically, I was looking for a way to secure the cradle and motor without using adhesive, BUT...adhesive may yet have to play a part in this endeavor. Zip ties could work, but I'm looking for something astheticlly pleasing as well (this may not matter to anyone else but me).
Just to give a little background, the first motor mount was just a piece of .040" sheet styrene with .156" tubing glued to the bottom. I glued the tubing to the sheet using the chassis as a "jig" or guide to line up all the pieces just right. After everything set up, I tried inserting a screw, and everything was going smooth until the screw bottomed out and sheared off the leg.
On the next mount, I started with .250" square stock. I laid out all the measurements and drilled (actually milled) .156" holes at precise intervals so that one the legs were inserted, the mount would line up with the holes in the Athearn chassis. After I drilled the holes, I cemented lengths of .156" tubing, and came up with this:
I was thinking about buying a 1" (15/16" to be exact) round nosed router bit to cut the curved recess for the motor to sit in. I know it seems a bit excessive, but I get like that sometimes!
Donnell
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Post by nebrzephyr on Oct 3, 2012 12:07:46 GMT -8
Donnell.......I agree making a curved "bed" for the motor is a good idea, even if you use silicone to fasten the motor to the cradle.
Not sure what you have that you would use with the router bit. I tried one time using a router cutter bit with styrene in a variable speed drill and it was either too slow so as not to cut, of too fast and melted the styrene. Maybe I just didn't try enough speeds.
So what I have doing is using a A-Line "cradle", super glue it to the Athearn chassis and then silicone the motor in the cradle. The cradle seems to line the motor (Kato) shafts up perfectly with the gear towers.
Bob
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Post by shoofly on Oct 3, 2012 12:31:29 GMT -8
Basically, I was looking for a way to secure the cradle and motor without using adhesive, BUT...adhesive may yet have to play a part in this endeavor. Zip ties could work, but I'm looking for something astheticlly pleasing as well (this may not matter to anyone else but me).
I was thinking about buying a 1" (15/16" to be exact) round nosed router bit to cut the curved recess for the motor to sit in. I know it seems a bit excessive, but I get like that sometimes!
Donnell Donnell, why not just use some fine mesh velcro between the motor and the cradle and call it done? I mean you could make a harness for the motor out of styrene and secure it on the ends and screw it all together to the end of the cradle, but why bother? As a musician i use velcro to hold my pedals to a mounting surface and they don't budge! It takes quite a bit of force to remove the pedals at times but the do come off for servicing when necessary. Mechanically u just need something to keep the motor from spinning in place. If you make the cradle mount TOO solid you will transfer motor vibration to the rest of the chassis making the motor actually resonate more in the shell. It is, afterall, an acoustic chamber. I suspect this is why many use caulk, foam tape, or other such dampening materials. If servicing a motor is a big deal, then heck, velcro might be a great way to adjust and service the motor after the cradle is mounted. additional thoughts- Do any of you guys remember the Helix humper motor? It quickly became my favorite way to repower an Athearn Blue Box Diesel. The motors came with mounts that accepted the BB slippery motor mounts without additional engineering or caulking. A google search reveals they are still around! alliancelocomotiveproducts.com/Further research shows they have a motor mount cradle sans motor for an Athearn BB (might need some adhesive to get your fav motor to mount to the cradle):  and here's one with the motor attached where you can reuse the Athearn flywheels. I think this is designed for a BB, but might work well for an RTR with hex universal drivelines.  I think as the RTR era loses it's shiny box luster and we all try to actually run this stuff, we quickly realize that a lot of this stuff is all show and no go. I think modelers prematurely wrote off repowering locomotives with the assumption the higher price meant it would run better. Time to usher in the new era of repowering locomotives...anyone try regear some of these units with oddball gear ratios?  Chris P. |
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