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Post by edwardsutorik on Jul 14, 2020 16:16:30 GMT -8
Yes, amazing.
It's amazing to me that they actually go through people's PM's, and delete ones they don't like.
I had thought it amazing when they deleted a topic without ever informing the OP of it, or explaining why. But this is "amazing-er". I can see where they might want to have some control over what is sort of their public face. But to get so anxious over a private conversation? And to feel the need to snoop?
Just wow.
It must be a hellish place to work.
Yeah, I guess I'm a little miffed.
Ed
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Post by cf7 on Jul 14, 2020 16:40:21 GMT -8
How do you know this is fact? I agree...I wouldn't want to work there, but this doesn't make any sense.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Jul 14, 2020 17:02:03 GMT -8
I know 'cause it happened to me:
the PM part, just in the last couple of days. Kalmbach has stopped alerting you for a PM, so you have to go check to see if someone's answered you. I did so, and my PM was gone. So was the reply. All my others are still there.
the disappeared topic, maybe a year ago.
Ed
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 14, 2020 18:21:30 GMT -8
I've been ticked at Kalmbach since they stopped putting Model Railroader in a plastic bag (paper envelope before that). I have a mail slot and *every* issue the USPS would try to jam the now-unbaggied MR through it. The cover and/or pages would tear and I'd have to call Kalmbach for a replacement. Eventually I gave up and never renewed.
Wonder how many subscriptions were cost by the business school genius that thought saving a penny a magazine was smart.
This had to have been 25 years ago. I had been a loyal subscriber since the 60's.
I think there are a lot of non-train people in the model railroad industry that think it's "just another business". Tisn't.
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Post by brakie on Jul 15, 2020 1:08:44 GMT -8
IMHO MR might be afraid they will loose advertisers if they let some post and comments stand. Then there is those posts that is contrary to MR "expert" authors has taught over the years.
As far as private conversations they had no right to monitor those conversations.
I haven't read MR since May of 2019 and that's sad because at one time I eagerly awaited each new issue. I still read Trains magazine.
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Post by riogrande on Jul 15, 2020 4:28:05 GMT -8
MR forums software is hopelessly flawed. About a week ago, my login no longer worked using Chrome. Steve O said delete cookies, so I did. Still no worky. For a while I could log in using IE or Edge but now it lets me log in on those two browsers but as soon as I click on a topic I get the following error: Sorry, there was a problem with your last request!
Either the site is offline or an unhandled error occurred. We apologize and have logged the error. Please try your request again or if you know who your site administrator is let them know too.
I went back to Chrome and when I go to the main forum page, it shows me as one of the logged in users but then offers me the option of logging in, which fails everytime. The MR forums site is the only website I have any issue with. Conclusion, their software is flawed and broken. BTW, this issue seems to happen with some regularity in the past year or two and after a few weeks it somehow resolves itself.
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 15, 2020 6:06:55 GMT -8
I'm not sure some of these companjes recognize how critical good software is. Both Walthers and Modeltrainstuff used to have great online stores, then both were redone and the results were not good. They're not alone. I tried ordering something from Musicians Friend a few weeks ago and it refused to let me log in. It was one of their deal of the hour things, and I spent 20 minutes trying to buy the darn item. Ran out if time so called them a couple minutes before the deal ended. By the time I got a real salesman the deal was over and they wouldn't honor it. Guess who isn't getting my business anymore.
We don't want fancy gimmicks and don't care about cutesy graphics. We want an e-store that is simple, rugged and reliable. Same for forums. I think some sales & marketing types get software revised just so they can appear to be doing something. If it ain't broke, don't fix it!
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Post by edwardsutorik on Jul 15, 2020 6:56:34 GMT -8
I agree that the Kalmbach forum software is approaching laughable. Might even have hit it and run over it. Repeatedly.
But I WAS referring to a person employed by Kalmbach intentionally reading PM's, and then deleting some. Well, one, anyway.
And also deleting a topic without feeling the need to explain himself. "We're the phone company. We don't HAVE to care."
If they only had the chance to throw people in jail, they'd be just like a certain country that is being irritating right now. But without the ability to produce something we want to buy.
Ed
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Post by SOMECALLMETIM on Jul 15, 2020 7:57:59 GMT -8
Instead of coming here with an unproven hypothesis why don't you try to duplicate the results - specifically with the PM so you can know for certain PMs are read and deleted? I'll gladly play along with you on that forum. Oh, hopefully you were not spreading political, religious, or hate speech - if that's the case, I want no part of it. I agree that the Kalmbach forum software is approaching laughable. Might even have hit it and run over it. Repeatedly. But I WAS referring to a person employed by Kalmbach intentionally reading PM's, and then deleting some. Well, one, anyway. And also deleting a topic without feeling the need to explain himself. "We're the phone company. We don't HAVE to care." If they only had the chance to throw people in jail, they'd be just like a certain country that is being irritating right now. But without the ability to produce something we want to buy. Ed
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Post by riogrande on Jul 15, 2020 8:08:53 GMT -8
I've been on MR forums for a long time, well over 10 years, and don't recall a PM ever being deleted. Their softare is so crappy and glitchy that nothing would surprise me. Regarding the PM system, for many years I've not seen a flag notifying me I have a PM. Only way to know is randomly check for them.
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Post by bnsf971 on Jul 15, 2020 8:26:57 GMT -8
Instead of coming here with an unproven hypothesis why don't you try to duplicate the results - specifically with the PM so you can know for certain PMs are read and deleted? I'll gladly play along with you on that forum. Oh, hopefully you were not spreading political, religious, or hate speech - if that's the case, I want no part of it. I agree that the Kalmbach forum software is approaching laughable. Might even have hit it and run over it. Repeatedly. But I WAS referring to a person employed by Kalmbach intentionally reading PM's, and then deleting some. Well, one, anyway. And also deleting a topic without feeling the need to explain himself. "We're the phone company. We don't HAVE to care." If they only had the chance to throw people in jail, they'd be just like a certain country that is being irritating right now. But without the ability to produce something we want to buy. Ed I wouldn't want to be party to a bunch of hate speech, either, but if it were in a PRIVATE message, it should be just that. Private. Between two people, without Big Brother reading your messages.
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Post by dti406 on Jul 15, 2020 8:28:25 GMT -8
We don't want fancy gimmicks and don't care about cutesy graphics. We want an e-store that is simple, rugged and reliable. Same for forums. I think some sales & marketing types get software revised just so they can appear to be doing something. If it ain't broke, don't fix it! It's not the sales and marketing types, its the IT guys that are trying to justify their existence. Rick Jesionowski
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Post by riogrande on Jul 15, 2020 8:45:05 GMT -8
I know Mr. O does moderating but it doesn't seem to be a primary duty; rather more of an annoyance at keeping thing to a dull roar. There are some "characters" over there - more coffee klatsch type of posts and jibber jabber.
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Post by 12bridge on Jul 15, 2020 11:42:18 GMT -8
I vaguely remember hearing stories of this happening over there many years ago.
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Post by brakie on Jul 15, 2020 12:46:53 GMT -8
I vaguely remember hearing stories of this happening over there many years ago. When I joined MR forums in 2001 it was a war zone.. A topic on DCC vs. DC was sure to become a flame war.. I recall one topic that went South when the OP said he will no longer buy Athearn BB cars because they was foobies and relics of the past and will buy only Atlas. Red Caboose, P2K and IM freight cars..
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Post by Colin 't Hart on Jul 15, 2020 14:44:38 GMT -8
I vaguely remember hearing stories of this happening over there many years ago. When I joined MR forums in 2001 it was a war zone.. A topic on DCC vs. DC was sure to become a flame war.. I recall one topic that went South when the OP said he will no longer buy Athearn BB cars because they was foobies and relics of the past and will buy only Atlas. Red Caboose, P2K and IM freight cars.. Hah! Some things never change!
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Post by edwardsutorik on Jul 15, 2020 14:55:18 GMT -8
Instead of coming here with an unproven hypothesis why don't you try to duplicate the results - specifically with the PM so you can know for certain PMs are read and deleted? I'll gladly play along with you on that forum. Oh, hopefully you were not spreading political, religious, or hate speech - if that's the case, I want no part of it. You are certainly not required to be a "part of it." I'm pretty sure my hypothesis WAS proven: I sent a PM to another member of the Kalmbach forum. I checked my messages from time to time--the message was there--he had not responded. I checked my messages again, and the message was deleted--by this, I mean to say that it was gone, and I hadn't done it. The title was still there, however. There was just a big blank space where the message was. Other PM messages were still there--only this particular one was gone. So it is established not ALL of my messages were gone. My hypothesis is that someone from Kalmbach read my message, and decided to remove it. I DO know my PM was deleted. Because it is not there, and I did not do it. And I assume it was read--otherwise it would be a random event--just Poof, and it was gone, for no reason at all. Yeah, right. The subject, by the way, was a defense of (most) of the members on this forum. There was nothing mean or angry involved. I like the other member. I was trying to say he was in error with his opinion. I made no mention of politics. I made no mention of religion. I didn't say a mean thing about any individual or group. Now, as for duplicating the results: I am not sure why I would want to do that. And to do it, I'd have to fabricate some kind of message that I KNEW should prompt such actions, and then see if it did. For such a guarantee, it would have to be pretty offensive, or whatever. And I just don't feel like doing that. Ed
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 15, 2020 14:57:08 GMT -8
I agree that the Kalmbach forum software is approaching laughable. Might even have hit it and run over it. Repeatedly. But I WAS referring to a person employed by Kalmbach intentionally reading PM's, and then deleting some. Well, one, anyway. And also deleting a topic without feeling the need to explain himself. "We're the phone company. We don't HAVE to care." If they only had the chance to throw people in jail, they'd be just like a certain country that is being irritating right now. But without the ability to produce something we want to buy. Ed "The Phone Company" I knew it! If embed doesn't work:
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Post by edwardsutorik on Jul 15, 2020 20:16:11 GMT -8
"The Phone Company" I knew it! You are clearly a man of sophistication and intelligence (as am I). Unfortunately (a word we do like to use frequently), you seem to have missed Miss Tomlin's famous quote. And, also unfortunately, I couldn't bring it up from Youtube. Ed
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 16, 2020 0:08:02 GMT -8
"The Phone Company" I knew it! You are clearly a man of sophistication and intelligence (as am I). Unfortunately (a word we do like to use frequently), you seem to have missed Miss Tomlin's famous quote. And, also unfortunately, I couldn't bring it up from Youtube. Ed I never before made the connection between Lily and forum moderators: the veil has now been lifted from my eyes, it makes sense now and it's so obvious, it's, it's... diabolical! I should have known. Everything. Everything. All of it. Think of Hunter Harrison and CSX. It's Lily and PST (Precision Scheduled Telephony). Customers being mocked and disconnected. Forum messages being deleted. Robocalls. Telemarketing. Infomercials. Amway. Time-shares. Fluorinated water. Pop-up ads. Cookies. All of it. We could have stopped it. We didnt1. What have we done?
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Post by bdhicks on Jul 16, 2020 8:32:44 GMT -8
I had the same log-in problem riogrande had, but after I deleted my cookies it seems to have disassociated my forum account from my magazine account, so now where it used to have my forum info it just has a button to "Create a screen name". And there doesn't seem to be any way to contact them about forum issues (I reported it as an Other Issue about my magazine account, but haven't heard back). I mostly just lurk over there nowadays so it's not a big deal if I have to just set up a different screen name, but I'd rather keep the connection to my old stuff if possible.
It's also pretty silly that they still don't have secure log-ins.
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Post by riogrande on Jul 16, 2020 9:13:54 GMT -8
Ah Lilly Tomlin from Dan Rowan and Dick Martins Laugh-in, a show I watched many moons ago as a kid. Sock it to me!
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Post by grahamline on Jul 16, 2020 21:26:16 GMT -8
Judging by a recent online survey, most magazine-sponsored model railroad massage forums are hotbeds of social maldevelopment and/or overdeveloped egos. Very hard to find accurate modeling information. Recent questions and answers on the Oregon Short Line are an example.
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 17, 2020 8:39:31 GMT -8
Judging by a recent online survey, most magazine-sponsored model railroad massage forums are hotbeds of social maldevelopment and/or overdeveloped egos. Very hard to find accurate modeling information. Recent questions and answers on the Oregon Short Line are an example. Your OSL needs have been heard! Coming soon...
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Post by riogrande on Jul 17, 2020 8:59:52 GMT -8
Judging by a recent online survey, most magazine-sponsored model railroad massage forums are hotbeds of social maldevelopment and/or overdeveloped egos. Very hard to find accurate modeling information. I haven't read that survey, but the characterization fits from what I see at MR forums. There are a few I steer clear of or try not to get in their cross-hairs.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Jul 17, 2020 11:42:21 GMT -8
Judging by a recent online survey, most magazine-sponsored model railroad massage forums... What's the statistical sample for "most"? Two? Ed
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Post by brakie on Jul 17, 2020 19:18:37 GMT -8
Judging by a recent online survey, most magazine-sponsored model railroad massage forums are hotbeds of social maldevelopment and/or overdeveloped egos. Very hard to find accurate modeling information. I haven't read that survey, but the characterization fits from what I see at MR forums. There are a few I steer clear of or try not to get in their cross-hairs. Jim, I think there's overdeveloped egos on every forum. Compared to the old Atlas forum and the old MR forum things are pretty tame. I haven't seen a good old fashion forum brawl over which DCC system to buy or DCC vs. DC for a long time-not that I want to return to as Michael Buffer would say "Lett's get ready to rumble" days. MR seems to have a pecking order on which topics stands and which gets locked even if there is some dicey comments .
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Post by riogrande on Jul 17, 2020 19:26:20 GMT -8
Sure Larry, but this discussion is about the Klambake MR forums. I agree with the other guys comments.
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 17, 2020 22:44:08 GMT -8
"Klambake" Man, I remember back when MR & RMC were the only game in town and people would write letters to the editor. Classified ads, lists of upcoming events, all those pages of hobby shops... so many gone now We may have better models and instantaneous communication and gratification but I do miss those days. Waiting every month for the magazines to arrive. Saving pennies from the newspaper route. Reading the tiny print on the AHC ads or the AHM "funeral sales". I think I got as much pleasure if not more out of watching the old Tyco or Lionel set we would put up each year.
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Post by valenciajim on Jul 18, 2020 1:35:50 GMT -8
Ah Lilly Tomlin from Dan Rowan and Dick Martins Laugh-in, a show I watched many moons ago as a kid. Sock it to me! Wasn't Judy Carne the "sock it to me" girl? Lily Tomlin was the frumpy old lady who was upset with Arte Johnson's moves on her. She was also the telephone operator. It is hard to believe that show is over 50 years old!
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