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Post by linessouth on Apr 19, 2023 11:25:08 GMT -8
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Post by richardthomasatal on Apr 19, 2023 12:26:39 GMT -8
Oh boy what a mess. The prices aren't even what most dealers offer and they are sitting on so much inventory because of their own doing. Now, they cancel the VIA Poppy P42 because they announced it before they had licensing agreement in place. Athearn is in a sad state of affairs, gentlemen. |
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Post by packer on Apr 19, 2023 12:33:20 GMT -8
Athearn is in a sad state of affairs, gentlemen. Did you just now notice this?  One of those CB&Q ACF 2970s is tempting tho. They are nicer than the Intermountain IMO |
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Post by alexandrianick on Apr 19, 2023 12:41:00 GMT -8
I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on the poppy scheme. They'd likely believed that it would be covered by the licensing agreement with Via and didn't find out until after the announcement that it was not. Far bigger entities with far more resources have made the same mistake with thinking that comprehensive licenses were broader than they were.
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Post by richardthomasatal on Apr 19, 2023 13:10:15 GMT -8
I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on the poppy scheme. They'd likely believed that it would be covered by the licensing agreement with Via and didn't find out until after the announcement that it was not. Far bigger entities with far more resources have made the same mistake with thinking that comprehensive licenses were broader than they were. Ok, I'll give them a pass on that even though they should have verified. That just leaves me with a few more recent issues: The incorrect SD60E scheme they called a heritage unit announcement, the website sale which undercuts dealers but yet is still not cheap enough to sell anything, and the multiple quality issues I've had with their models recently. Who buys direct from Athearn? That has to be a small group of uninformed people. If I wanted something Athearn had in stock and my hobby shop didn't, I would order it through the hobby shop and get the hobby shop discount. |
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Post by drsvelte on Apr 19, 2023 13:22:17 GMT -8
How do you figure this?
The prices are most competitive - for example, the PS-2 2600cf hoppers are priced well below Lombard plus no shipping charges.
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Post by richardthomasatal on Apr 19, 2023 14:20:28 GMT -8
How do you figure this? The prices are most competitive - for example, the PS-2 2600cf hoppers are priced well below Lombard plus no shipping charges. Ok, I'll let you have it your way like this is burger king. Now, the PS-2 2600cf hoppers are priced well below Lombard. But now they're undercutting their own dealer network when they could have sold them to dealers to clear the Athearn warehouse. To my original point, $360 is on the sound equipped SD90MACs and that is not such a great deal. Either way, Athearn should have worked through their dealer network to get rid of inventory. They cut back on train shows. They were a no show to some train show last year and won't go back to the OKC show and they expect to maintain sales with cutting back advertising and travel so much. |
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Post by hudsonyard on Apr 19, 2023 14:55:49 GMT -8
Man you people would complain about a free lunch.
Couple of the multipacks prices are hard to argue with, maybe when payday hits i'll double back and see whats left.
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Post by richardthomasatal on Apr 19, 2023 14:59:38 GMT -8
Man you people would complain about a free lunch. Couple of the multipacks prices are hard to argue with, maybe when payday hits i'll double back and see whats left. Everyone wants dealers to stay around, everyone wants everybody to support your local hobby shop but when Athearn undercuts their own dealers in some cases then its oh that's ok because it benefits my wallet. Choose an argument or just stop with the supporting local hobby shop talk because companies undercutting dealers is not supportive to the hobby shops AT ALL. |
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Post by hudsonyard on Apr 19, 2023 15:02:51 GMT -8
If you think the one local guy here who is a horizon dealer is gonna bring in stuff at these prices you are nuts, he might get the cheaper price, but you sure as hell aren't. Pretty sure the trains are just packing material for the RC stuff anyway. He owns the shopping center he's in with a hobby lobby and kohls next door, i'm sure he won't be staring at you with empty eyes and empty hands because athearn is blowing out year old stock.
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Post by richardthomasatal on Apr 19, 2023 15:21:09 GMT -8
If you think the one local guy here wo a horizon dealer is gonna bring in stuff at these prices you are nuts, he might get the cheaper price, but you sure as hell aren't. Pretty sure the trains are just packing material for the RC stuff anyway. He owns the shopping center he's in with a hobby lobby and kohls next door, i'm sure he won't be staring at you with empty eyes and empty hands because athearn is blowing out year old stock. There's this thing called online train stores. Lots of them. I can call most of them up and pre order an item at discount even if that item is sitting on Athearn's shelf and already released. It sccrews them too. |
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Post by severn on Apr 19, 2023 15:22:20 GMT -8
Well... I'm determined to get something but what it is, I don't know...
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Post by lars on Apr 19, 2023 18:05:33 GMT -8
I just partook in this sale and was happy to have free shipping to boot.
But between the Athearn inventory sitting around, Tangent items taking much longer to sell out, and Rapido mentioning that they’re also saddled with excess inventory, we may be seeing a bit of a demand slowdown. Maybe it’s a COVID hangover brought on by expectations that demand would stay strong. However, I also wonder if we’re hitting a bit of a high-fidelity model saturation point.
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abm
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Post by abm on Apr 19, 2023 20:39:09 GMT -8
But between the Athearn inventory sitting around, Tangent items taking much longer to sell out, and Rapido mentioning that they’re also saddled with excess inventory, we may be seeing a bit of a demand slowdown. Maybe it’s a COVID hangover brought on by expectations that demand would stay strong. However, I also wonder if we’re hitting a bit of a high-fidelity model saturation point. This for sure, and several manufacturers went into overdrive with the announcements/pre-orders/releases as well, no doubt further stretching wallets. I did partake in Rapido's "mystery box" offer, however... eager to see what shows up. |
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Post by riogrande on Apr 20, 2023 3:04:04 GMT -8
I just partook in this sale and was happy to have free shipping to boot. I did as well. Definitely worth it if you find rolling stock you could use. While I haven't been tracking Athearn inventory, I too have noticed Tangent rolling stock taking a lot longer to sell down. The 4750 hoppers used to sell out pretty fast but there is a lot still there. |
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Post by cera2254 on Apr 20, 2023 4:20:13 GMT -8
Im sure a lot of has to do with simply the increase in price of everything. It seems like many basics are 20-50% more expensive than they were just a year ago.
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Post by jonklein611 on Apr 20, 2023 4:22:49 GMT -8
Oh boy what a mess. The prices aren't even what most dealers offer and they are sitting on so much inventory because of their own doing. Now, they cancel the VIA Poppy P42 because they announced it before they had licensing agreement in place. Athearn is in a sad state of affairs, gentlemen. When did they announce that? - Edit, I saw their post on facebook. |
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Post by lars on Apr 20, 2023 4:41:51 GMT -8
I just partook in this sale and was happy to have free shipping to boot. I did as well. Definitely worth it if you find rolling stock you could use. While I haven't been tracking Athearn inventory, I too have noticed Tangent rolling stock taking a lot longer to sell down. The 4750 hoppers used to sell out pretty fast but there is a lot still there. A lot of 86’ Greenville’s hanging around, too. And I’ve definitely seen some Rapido stuff being dumped on Toy Train Heaven. I hope that this put the manufactures in check a bit. The past few years enabled manufactures to implement some hefty price increases (and at times, for some marginal products). Personally, I have enough stuff to keep me detailing and weathering for the rest of my life, so aside from a few key items, I’m only likely to buy if something’s a deal. |
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Post by riogrande on Apr 20, 2023 5:28:53 GMT -8
A lot of 86’ Greenville’s hanging around, too. And I’ve definitely seen some Rapido stuff being dumped on Toy Train Heaven. I hope that this put the manufactures in check a bit. The past few years enabled manufactures to implement some hefty price increases (and at times, for some marginal products). Personally, I have enough stuff to keep me detailing and weathering for the rest of my life, so aside from a few key items, I’m only likely to buy if something’s a deal.[/quote] Agreed. The apparent slowing down of sales should hopefully put manufacturing in check. Speaking of hefty price increases, those Athearn 45' trailers that were priced at $34.99 and 39.99 (primed for grime) - there are a lot of them in the sale so those appear to be slow sellers and at those prices no wonder. I have examples of them from around ten years ago that came in 2-packs for the sale price of those singles on the sale pages. I'm in a similar situation, "enough stuff" meaning hard to justify much more. Thankfully most of the announcements my wallet is safe save the Rapido SP/SSW B-70 boxcars - I'm a big SP fan of that era and they fit thru the Rockies for sure. The lingering inventory issue does have me concerned, and maybe Rapido will hopefully put the brakes on out of necessity which might take the emphasis off of quantity and back onto quality, which seems to have been a growing problem in the past few years. It's always nice to see Tangent continuing to produce high quality rolling stock and the 86' Greenville's are lovely but I'm up to my ears in them and am actually thankful that the BRO versions don't fit my modeling region - though that magenta DT&I is pretty and I expect it will be a good seller. |
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Post by markfj on Apr 20, 2023 7:49:44 GMT -8
Are the Genesis 50' PC&F SS boxcars with 14' plug doors fairly accurate? I might pick up one of the Southern Pacific or Cotten Belt cars, $29.99 seems like a great price for a Genesis car.
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Post by riogrande on Apr 20, 2023 8:15:12 GMT -8
Are the Genesis 50' PC&F SS boxcars with 14' plug doors fairly accurate? I might pick up one of the Southern Pacific or Cotten Belt cars, $29.99 seems like a great price for a Genesis car. I saw those too, but I bought a couple each of the SP and SSW versions in the yellow box release years ago for around $20 ea but $29.99 is a good deal in the present. www.railgoat.railfan.net/spcars/byclass/box/b070-68.htmIt sure looks like they are good copies of the B70=68 SP boxcar based on Railgoat. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2023 8:19:49 GMT -8
How is Horizon/Athearn "undercutting" their dealers? If dealers pay their bill within a certain time period (used to be 30 days but might now be only 10) they get an added discount below dealer net cost.
As best I can tell, the Athearn SALE price is matching the current (actual shopping cart, not advertised) selling price at Lombard Hobbies, Hiawatha Hobbies, and Spring Creek, and likely others. Additionally, if you create an account with Lombard Hobbies, and log in, they show you personally a LOWER selling price than what is visible if anybody just goes to shopping cart (at least once you've bought enough from Lombard).
All day long, every day, ScaleTrains, ExactRail, Tangent and others sell items off their website for the exact same price point as many dealers have their items. ScaleTrains also gives you free shipping of in stock items once your current order exceeds $100.
Yet nobody is on here complaining about ScaleTrains or the others doing exactly the same thing as Athearn is currently doing for their sale? And the sale is only a few days.
Why is Athearn so evil and the other guys who are doing the exact same thing are somehow not? Call a spade a spade.
So far as "supporting the local dealers" is concerned, I don't see very much pushback on these forums from when certain manufacturers did some shady things (like cut off their dealer networks after the manufacturer became established). I go to church too; bragging about one's faith doesn't matter in business; it's too easy to just be a hypocrite when actual money is involved. Too many people on this very forum just took the manufacturer's word--hook, line and sinker--while not listening to the other side (that and individual dealers generally will not come on here to share their side of that story for fear of any additional negative blowback). Virtually nobody was speaking up on behalf of supporting the local dealers then--clearly some just want the best possible price for their Asia-produced goodies--and don't really give a d__n about the local dealers. Certainly not when their personal wallet is on the line.
Many customers now go to the local train shop, open and play with ("test run") models, and then will go buy the same model from an online merchant rather than from the local store. My buddy just looks as that as just business now. The worst was when a customer bought a particular MTH O-gauge engine after numerous saturdays of running it in the store, took it home, ran it on his DCS system--the engine had like 166 scale miles on it--then the customer went back to the store and wanted a discount because the loco was not "new" anymore, when he was the person who put the 166 scale miles on the engine. You hope that you treat the customers well enough that they will come back and buy in person from you even if some items cost a little bit more for the customer service provided.
I buy as much as possible through my local store, but he knows there's items he cannot get for me (he's simply too small a fish) or he knows there's places that have it in stock and I can get a much better price. He doesn't get mad about it because I still buy plenty from him, and he's making a killing on my gently used stuff (40% profit with no up-front costs; I only get paid when he gets paid). Some weekends we even go buy from other train stores that are open sundays like Mainline Hobbies and Tommy Gilbert's.
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Post by gevohogger on Apr 20, 2023 8:49:41 GMT -8
So far as "supporting the local dealers" is concerned, I don't see very much pushback on these forums from when certain manufacturers did some shady things (like cut off their dealer networks after the manufacturer became established). Say what? People here DO complain about when that happens. OK, sure, it's mostly just one guy... But he complains early and often. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2023 8:54:28 GMT -8
Look I'm far from perfect; I just want to see some kind of consistency. It does us no good as a hobby or group of hobbyists to see manufacturers, who are trying to improve, get bashed as...readily...as seems to occur. I'm not saying to give them a free pass on their mistakes, far from that, but sometimes the vitriol and hyperbole goes a bit too far, even from me.
They don't get up every day and say "how can I shaft my customers today?" Nobody does that.
Some just put a higher priority on certain things than others do. I still see too many cheap compromises on high-end expensive engines--things like cheap essentially self-tapping screws into plastic bolsters to hold body shells on. Why? That means the shell can only ever be removed a couple times before locktite or something else will be needed to hold it on. At least some of the manufacturers are screwing through coupler boxes into the metal frame, for some of the body mounting, but others are not doing that. They must assume most models never get opened, or not more than once, idk.
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Post by severn on Apr 20, 2023 8:58:02 GMT -8
My guess is athearn would or wanted to push their inventory out to dealers but they are full up too. So they priced near the going dealer rates and... Just hope they can raise some capital.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2023 8:59:50 GMT -8
Yes, they are beholding to Horizon, so Horizon is calling the shots, and some items just apparently didn't hit the target market as well as hoped.
People are buying the sale items. I waffled last night on getting a CN-GTW heritage engine for my son, and today all the ones with sound were gone. Last night they still had them.
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Post by hudsonyard on Apr 20, 2023 14:53:17 GMT -8
did my best to destroy my local hobby shop and "online dealers" by getting a few more TOFC flats and CBQ covered hoppers
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Post by lvrr325 on Apr 20, 2023 22:49:00 GMT -8
Athearn is short discount, so for smaller guys to try to price match may not be worth the effort. I have a source for Athearn but it's an RC guy so I'd probably have to sell close to full price to make anything.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2023 8:30:08 GMT -8
Eeewww yuck. I stand corrected. That sucks.
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Post by milgentrains on Apr 21, 2023 9:18:10 GMT -8
I've just placed an order for some cars.
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