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Post by lvrr325 on Dec 1, 2023 13:54:03 GMT -8
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Post by drsvelte on Dec 1, 2023 14:53:36 GMT -8
Wow. This proto photo from Trainiax.net shows there are gaps, but they are very small.  |
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Post by kentuckysouthernrwy on Dec 1, 2023 14:59:26 GMT -8
Think I'd have put solid rails on and a small black line to look like a gap, rather than the ham handed method they used.
Do they telescope up from those brackets on the prototypes?
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Post by lvrr325 on Dec 1, 2023 15:14:00 GMT -8
Those flat pads under the handrail supports are huge compared to the real cars that have them.
I guess not all the cars have these, just the one I pulled out happened to. I only went with a 17001A, 02A, 05A and 06A. The last two don't have the handrail.
If none sell at GTE this weekend they'll be on eBay as a choice listing during the week.
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Post by 12bridge on Dec 1, 2023 15:26:38 GMT -8
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Post by 690 on Dec 1, 2023 16:02:49 GMT -8
Those flat pads under the handrail supports are huge compared to the real cars that have them. I guess not all the cars have these, just the one I pulled out happened to. I only went with a 17001A, 02A, 05A and 06A. The last two don't have the handrail. If none sell at GTE this weekend they'll be on eBay as a choice listing during the week.  The flat pads are a little thicker than they could be, and they’re not fitted very well, but they’re pretty close to the right size otherwise. Also, the gaps in the handrails are obvious in this picture, although the waviness is unfortunate. I’ve got two ordered that should be here at some point next week. |
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Post by hudsonyard on Dec 1, 2023 19:16:29 GMT -8
looks like a walthers mainline car with air hoses, well walthers wouldn't have warped railing with missing paint.
at least the cut lever isn't floating connected to nothing like my GN box.
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Post by Partial_List on Dec 1, 2023 22:32:21 GMT -8
looks like a walthers mainline car with air hoses, well walthers wouldn't have warped railing with missing paint. at least the cut lever isn't floating connected to nothing like my GN box. And at a Tangent/Moloco price point. |
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Post by cemr5396 on Dec 1, 2023 23:21:40 GMT -8
those railings, yikes. The other pictures I've seen of these cars don't look like that, I wonder if that is shipping damage.
The thing that I'm annoyed about is not only did they not bother to put hazmat placards on the cars at the factory (which is bare minimum for this price point at this point, even Walthers is doing it FFS), but the 'modeler applied' ones they supply in a bag with the cars are not even labelled with the appropriate UN hazard placard. You just get an 'empty' holder.
So you have a car which has only hauled one specific commodity since forever, and which is in all likelyhood NEVER un-placarded even when empty, that won't have proper placards on it even if you install the holders yourself. They might as well have not even bothered at that point.
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Post by lvrr325 on Dec 1, 2023 23:35:36 GMT -8
They were not packed how I would have, two on each end of a repurposed AMT 1/25 model kit box... but the packer probably had no idea the price of each piece. I would have put these in the middle and the less expensive (but just as nice) Bowser cars on the ends.
Still, the handrails are not next to the edge of the boxes, and they have a small piece of dense foam top center to help keep them from moving. I don't see how they flex enough in the package to lose paint. No flakes in the package either.
If I had pre-ordered and really wanted these I would not be happy.
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Post by Baikal on Dec 2, 2023 5:10:18 GMT -8
looks like a walthers mainline car with air hoses, well walthers wouldn't have warped railing with missing paint. at least the cut lever isn't floating connected to nothing like my GN box. And at a Tangent/Moloco price point.
Why pay less?
The cast flat grab irons on the end cage sides are about 4x scale. Unacceptable for the price.
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Post by cera2254 on Dec 2, 2023 12:58:11 GMT -8
What I find odd is that the ends look fine, but the sides at the end look bad.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Dec 2, 2023 13:11:49 GMT -8
What I find odd is that the ends look fine, but the sides at the end look bad. I believe that's because, in this case, a part of the mold was a solid block that was inside the end cage mold cavity. To get the endcage off of that block, the inside surfaces of the end cage sides had to be a single level. If they had wanted the grabs on the sides to be better shaped, they'd have to have more complex molds, where the "inner block" would have been broken up into pieces such that the outer faces of that block, facing the car sides, would have to be able to pull inwards to allow the part to be released. Then you could have grabs much closer to the proper dimensions. Rapido chose the former method. Of course, Rapido also could have used wire grabs. Rapido chose not to. Ed PS: I thought of another method to do those side grabs: you could have some blocks that slide upwards, on the inside of the cavity and the width of the grabs. This, then, would move the inner surface of the grabs outward, and make them thinner. However, the inside face would still be flat; so it's probably not as wonderful as the first version. |
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Post by 12bridge on Dec 2, 2023 14:29:43 GMT -8
And at a Tangent/Moloco price point.
Why pay less?
The cast flat grab irons on the end cage sides are about 4x scale. Unacceptable for the price.
But it has "real chain" on the handbrake. ...its O scale, but its "real chain". |
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Post by unittrain on Dec 2, 2023 17:32:52 GMT -8
Those stirrups are huge 😳😳 yeah that car is not much above mainline level.
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Post by cemr5396 on Dec 2, 2023 18:22:08 GMT -8
well unfortunately the 'Rapido effect' is gonna be a thing....
now that they have made these cars the odds that anybody else ever will have pretty much evaporated.
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Post by csxt8400 on Dec 2, 2023 21:45:09 GMT -8
I cannot get over all new tooling having mixed grab irons on the ends like that. Why oh why.
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Post by Partial_List on Dec 2, 2023 23:35:02 GMT -8
well unfortunately the 'Rapido effect' is gonna be a thing.... now that they have made these cars the odds that anybody else ever will have pretty much evaporated. Yup, just like the Flexi Flo. |
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Post by packer on Dec 3, 2023 6:01:31 GMT -8
well unfortunately the 'Rapido effect' is gonna be a thing.... now that they have made these cars the odds that anybody else ever will have pretty much evaporated. Yup, just like the Flexi Flo. I thought the flexi-flow was decent? I don’t have one, but this car is just bad. I hope they don’t air mail the C30-7. But the RS11 and U25B seem to be nice, so there is hope? |
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Post by markfj on Dec 3, 2023 7:59:20 GMT -8
Agreed, the Flexi Flo cars are not that bad. I had two and only sold them off because I came across a buyer on HOswap that was looking for them.
Regarding this car; the overall presentation is rough. Aside from what has already been mentioned, that “rolled over” support for the running board looks really bad. I have no experience designing etched parts, but it looks like there is no relief or fold line on the backside of the part to make the bend cleaner.
Just my 2 cents, and that's all it's worth!
Mark
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Post by GP40P-2 on Dec 3, 2023 9:41:20 GMT -8
That prototype is kind of a cool looking car, too new for my modeling era, but would be an interesting project with the bare metal sides.
It is just me being old school where I actually like to build my stuff, but if I could find one cheap on a Hobbies for Men or Trainworld blow out, I'd get one. Reduce it to kit form, replace the oversized or poorly rendered parts, repaint including Metalizer for the body, find lettering if it even exists for this prototype, then reassemble. The basic dimensions and many of the parts seem usable, and some are garbage.
Rapido's target market are the ham fisted choo-choo old men running trains for the "grandkids" and want all the add on parts, but don't want them to break off. They have had some good models (I think I would like an M420 even though I have no reason to have one), but I wouldn't pre-order anything from them. I'll gladly hold out for a bargain (even though we don't have any train shows of significance out here in the desert southwest), maybe a cheap one would show up on the Weisman list, or on Ebay.
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Post by protofrtcar on Dec 3, 2023 10:01:44 GMT -8
Agreed, the Flexi Flo cars are not that bad. I had two and only sold them off because I came across a buyer on HOswap that was looking for them. Regarding this car; the overall presentation is rough. Aside from what has already been mentioned, that “rolled over” support for the running board looks really bad. I have no experience designing etched parts, but it looks like there is no relief or fold line on the backside of the part to make the bend cleaner. Just my 2 cents, and that's all it's worth! Mark Yes, that end walkway "rollover" is bad, REAL BAD. The GN 6-Panel boxcar roof walk was even worse. Nothing like the prototype with the two elongated prongs which bend down for the support. The support should be a separate bracket inset from the end of the roof walk (have a look at a Plano). Rapido are cheating with this shortcut method of etching roof walks. Does anyone at Rapido see this or even know how it should be done? I cringe to think of some of the future models I want that they are doing, but fear for the worse when they arrive. One thing can be said about Rapido " CONSISTENCY". They strike again! |
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Post by 690 on Dec 3, 2023 10:23:13 GMT -8
well unfortunately the 'Rapido effect' is gonna be a thing.... now that they have made these cars the odds that anybody else ever will have pretty much evaporated. A part of me is still hoping Otter Valley will do the earlier NSC or Thrall variations… |
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Post by mlwlover on Dec 3, 2023 10:32:56 GMT -8
Are any of the issues fixable? I know for the price you shouldn't have to but I have had to fix just about everything I have gotten.
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Post by csxt8400 on Dec 3, 2023 11:22:13 GMT -8
Are any of the issues fixable? I know for the price you shouldn't have to but I have had to fix just about everything I have gotten. I know what you're saying and I agree. I'm one of the types that if I need something, I'll buy it. And if I needed these cars to showcase important visual representation of a locale or place in time, it wouldn't stop me from purchasing them. I would say the grab irons are fixable. I'd say if the draft gear is too wide, it's fixable. All the roof stuff, especially long support brackets, seem to be a big chore for the person looking to make a masterpiece. A lot of things need to be straight/perpendicular to accent properly. To bring this up to a Tangent quality car would be less of a workbench session and more a labor of love. |
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Post by markfj on Dec 3, 2023 11:51:22 GMT -8
The long support brackets would need to be replaced just for the simple fact that they are so visible and the plastic versions are too wavy. Brass wire and solder should be all it takes to get those looking better. Also, I would want to investigate why those square mounting points are not sitting tight against the body.
Those cast-on caps on the sides of the discharge bays are really weak too and would probably look better with some bits of styrene rod glued up to make a more pronounced detail.
Not sure what I would do with the end cages. That’s probably the tipping point where the project moves from “minor upgrade” to complete “rebuild”. Don’t know what else to say other than good luck to those that tackle this project!
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Post by cemr5396 on Dec 3, 2023 12:54:51 GMT -8
well unfortunately the 'Rapido effect' is gonna be a thing.... now that they have made these cars the odds that anybody else ever will have pretty much evaporated. A part of me is still hoping Otter Valley will do the earlier NSC or Thrall variations… they have also hinted at maybe doing the later versions built by Trinity, which I would also welcome. I really do need chlorate cars for what I am modeling so I guess for now I will have to live with the Rapido model and its shortcomings (I already had them preordered with my LHS long ago) and keep hoping that either they redo/improve them on a later run and/or somebody else comes out with a better model of a different prototype. |
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Post by 690 on Dec 3, 2023 14:53:10 GMT -8
A part of me is still hoping Otter Valley will do the earlier NSC or Thrall variations… they have also hinted at maybe doing the later versions built by Trinity, which I would also welcome. I really do need chlorate cars for what I am modeling so I guess for now I will have to live with the Rapido model and its shortcomings (I already had them preordered with my LHS long ago) and keep hoping that either they redo/improve them on a later run and/or somebody else comes out with a better model of a different prototype. I really need the earlier versions (I model 1994), so I’m getting a couple of the Rapidos as a stand in for now. Unfortunately, given that no one has made an attempt to tackle these cars before these, and now the Rapido version is out, I’m not going to hold my breath on another version coming out. |
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Post by lvrr325 on Dec 4, 2023 10:50:16 GMT -8
Well, you can fix the top handrail issue by buying the cars without it.
I had an all time sales high at the GTE show, had these out, a few lookers, no buyers. I did not see anyone else with them out.
I was going to say these are like a couple steps up from Bachmann cars, but have you seen what they think their cars are worth lately? Maybe this is just where the hobby is going.
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Post by cemr5396 on Dec 4, 2023 11:47:58 GMT -8
Well, you can fix the top handrail issue by buying the cars without it. A lot of cars also had the handrails removed as time went on by simply pulling them out of their holders and discarding them with the un-used holders remaining attached to the car. The HO equivalent would be cutting them off with an exacto blade. Which I may very well end up doing to mine depending what they look like when they show up. |
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