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Post by mlehman on Sept 1, 2013 5:45:04 GMT -8
Ted/mecu18b asked to see more about my HOn3 narrowgauge diesels. To some narrowgaugers, just breathing the word "diesel" is enough to get you tar-and-feathered, if not left "decorating" the handiest trestle, as seemed to happen regularly on John Allen's Gorre & Daphetid. I like to convert and bash NG diesels, as they provide a relatively cheap source of motive power for those in narrowgauge. Here's one example: My HON3 conversion of the Liliput Zillerthalbahn D15 Gemeinder: cs.trains.com/mrr/f/88/p/215880/2372458.aspx#2372458More exotic and expensive was my build of a PSC DL535: cs.trains.com/mrr/f/88/p/210285/2302304.aspx#2302304Anyway, I did find my thread that illustrates all my diesels. Pardon the long link through Google Translate: linkA direct link, with an English translation further down the page: www.nexusboard.net/showthread.php?siteid=2408&threadid=326600I'll post some action pics soon. |
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mecu18b
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My doctor gave me six months to live, but when I couldn't pay the bill he gave me six months more.
Posts: 146
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Post by mecu18b on Sept 1, 2013 7:39:56 GMT -8
COO Norfolk Terminal
Modern Narrow Gauge
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mecu18b
Full Member
My doctor gave me six months to live, but when I couldn't pay the bill he gave me six months more.
Posts: 146
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Post by mecu18b on Sept 1, 2013 7:46:47 GMT -8
Guess ill have to post a couple of mine to keep up with the Jones...hehehehe    COO Norfolk Terminal Modern Narrow Gauge |
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Post by mlehman on Sept 1, 2013 8:05:02 GMT -8
I really like those big plows.
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mecu18b
Full Member
My doctor gave me six months to live, but when I couldn't pay the bill he gave me six months more.
Posts: 146
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Post by mecu18b on Sept 1, 2013 11:09:11 GMT -8
Ted/mecu18b asked to see more about my HOn3 narrowgauge diesels. To some narrowgaugers, just breathing the word "diesel" is enough to get you tar-and-feathered, if not left "decorating" the handiest trestle, as seemed to happen regularly on John Allen's Gorre & Daphetid. I like to convert and bash NG diesels, as they provide a relatively cheap source of motive power for those in narrowgauge. Here's one example: . Mike...Isn't that the truth. On some of the boards/groups your treated like you have punched a blind person when you mention diesels! Yet when you think about it hundreds of GE Alco locos still ply narrow gauge rails around the world. And if you want to see modern narrow gauge look at the WP&Y or the US gypsum railroad with there wide cab and other modern power. I have long said that some modelers, especially younger or less experienced one shy away from steam because of the cost and complexity of steam locos. Imagine however what you could do with a narrow gauge center cab diesel and a hand full of EBT hoppers. You can have a hell of a layout in a small space and in relatively small space. And it would inspire a whole new group of modelers to the hobby. look what Bachmann has done for ON30 in just a short couple years. Ted COO Norfolk Terminal Modern Narrow Gauge |
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Post by mlehman on Sept 2, 2013 7:22:33 GMT -8
Ted, Tried to update last night, but computer ate it then had to deal with other stuff. Let's have another go at it. Couldn't agree more with your assessment of the advantages of diesels as entry-level models into HOn3, as well a great performing, reliable motive power. I like my steam, but see no reason not to let the diesels roam. After all, they're not going to take over like they did in real life. My GE #1 (Jonan brass) is special to me. It's been assigned to the Cascade Branch for years -- while it's been nothing but a 2 foot section of staging hidden behind the arm of a mountain. Now that the branch has been finished to Crater Lake, traffic will require heavier power. In any case, #1 was my very first Ebay purchase years ago from Australia. I "revised" the paint to reflect new ownership. It's a good thing the loads go downhill, except for leaving the quarry    The heavier power won't include K-28 or K-36 locos, as the curves are too tight (20" min radius). Mostly, it's likely to be #1's big brothers on the roster, the 70-tonners:   I doubt that #28 will do any better on the branch with its C-C trucks than the DL535. The appropriately named Silverton is/was a narrowgauge mining line in Australia:  Now in proper paint, @28 leads the modernized San Juan.  The DL535 seems especially suited to NG service in proprtion to the K-28:  My NW2M conversions of the Kato NW2 are the most powerful power on the line. They like the Cascade Branch track just fine.   |
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mecu18b
Full Member
My doctor gave me six months to live, but when I couldn't pay the bill he gave me six months more.
Posts: 146
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Post by mecu18b on Sept 2, 2013 7:50:20 GMT -8
Mike, Did you build the 70 tonners? I tryed one with the NWSL gears and it didnt run so well. How does yours run?
Ted
COO Norfolk Terminal
Modern Narrow Gauge
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Post by mlehman on Sept 2, 2013 11:40:32 GMT -8
Ted,
Yep, did my own blacksmithing on them. I'd say give another one a go. My second was better than my first and the ingredients are pretty darn cheap. Dicing up those trucks is a bit nerve-wracking and fiddly. Soldering the bar across the bottom of the bearing slot in the sideframes went much better the second time. Tolerances are still pretty loose in the gear train even when they're running good.
I've got parts for a third. Would've been a fourth, but I had to rob parts off that chassis to keep the two I've done running. Good thing the B-mann builds 'em cheap -- because they are. He is getting better, as these latest runs are way ahead of the earlier ones in fit and finish.
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Post by cnj3676 on Sept 3, 2013 6:04:43 GMT -8
Gents: Thank you for broaching the subject of narrow gauge diesels. I find contemporary narrow gauge operations very interesting and would certainly consider getting into some NG modeling with diesel power. Here are a few images of some of my favorite NG diesels. These are examples of the Bombardier/MLW MX620 and GE/Babcock & Wilcox U10B units which operated on Guatemala's now dormant three foot gauge railway: www.le-rail.ch/bild/gua03i.jpgwww.le-rail.ch/bild/gua03z.jpgThanks again for bringing up the subject. Bob |
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Post by mlehman on Sept 3, 2013 20:26:45 GMT -8
Bob, Neat pictures. I have some past ties to Guatemala, but have never made it there to railfan yet, and there seems little prospect of seeing much now. I did take a few pics when I was in Nicaragua in 1982 and 1984. Here's another 3' one, which Bruce Pryor has listed as a GE "U?B":  |
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Post by cf7 on Sept 4, 2013 7:13:03 GMT -8
What a timely thread. I ordered the parts last week from NWSL to convert my 2nd loco to HOn3. I ended up selling the first before I completed it, but it did run well.
Has anyone done the conversion on a 44 tonner? I am strongly considering using this kit on one of these instead.
I plan on keeping this one!
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Post by mlehman on Sept 4, 2013 8:44:17 GMT -8
Chuck, I considered converting my 44-tonner. Pretty much the same drive as the 70-tonner, so this should work just fine. Instead, I decided to keep the 44-tonner standard gauge, while converting it to carry two sets of couplers so it can switch either SG or NG cars. This required a slightly extended endbeam (to clear the NG coupler's draft gear away from the end of the truck) and close tolerances to locate the couplers correctly for either gauge.   |
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Post by gp15nut on Mar 8, 2014 12:08:24 GMT -8
Ted I remember you having some Widecab units on MP15 bodies. I would like to know what you did it build it as I would like to build my own hon3 Diesels. My father got me into narrow gauge modeling the EBT in ON3. But as a young modeler in my 20's I appreciate narrow gauge steam but Im a diesel guy.
Rob
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mecu18b
Full Member
My doctor gave me six months to live, but when I couldn't pay the bill he gave me six months more.
Posts: 146
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Post by mecu18b on Mar 9, 2014 12:09:19 GMT -8
Rob,
I made them out of Atlas mp15dc units compleate with the sound that came with them. Ill have to look for the photos. I narrowed the trucks, used Gp 38 cabs and a short nose. they run great and have a neat look to them.The long hood of the units is the mp15 long hood so the drive and dcc board needs no work. They were not wide cabs.
COO Norfolk Terminal
Modern Narrow Gauge
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mecu18b
Full Member
My doctor gave me six months to live, but when I couldn't pay the bill he gave me six months more.
Posts: 146
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Post by mecu18b on Mar 9, 2014 12:18:35 GMT -8
Ted I remember you having some Widecab units on MP15 bodies. I would like to know what you did it build it as I would like to build my own hon3 Diesels. My father got me into narrow gauge modeling the EBT in ON3. But as a young modeler in my 20's I appreciate narrow gauge steam but Im a diesel guy. Rob COO Norfolk Terminal Modern Narrow Gauge |
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Post by Mark R. on Mar 9, 2014 12:41:21 GMT -8
Just because it's narrow gauge doesn't mean you can't have BIG power ! ....  Mark. |
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Post by TBird1958 on Mar 9, 2014 14:14:47 GMT -8
Just because it's narrow gauge doesn't mean you can't have BIG power ! .... Mark. Wow, whats the story with these? Very cool/unusual! |
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Post by mlehman on Mar 9, 2014 14:38:01 GMT -8
Just because it's narrow gauge doesn't mean you can't have BIG power ! .... Mark. Wow, whats the story with these? Very cool/unusual! Mark, They're in Brazil, along with some Tunnel Motors, my faves. The Brazilian economy is booming and they are building railroads to keep up. Apparently it's cost effective to import old American diesels and convert them to meter gauge (I think it's meter gauge, IIRC) B-B-B-Bs by using B trucks and span bolsters. Ted, I'd like to see those pics of the converted MP15s, too, if you find them. Just because you haven't hacked them into wide cabs yet doesn't mean it's not a good idea... |
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Post by Spikre on Mar 10, 2014 11:35:41 GMT -8
 the Guatamala unit may be a U6B,looks similar to Vietnamese U6Bs. not a Foreign Power expert,but it does look like pics Trains ran in the 60s. about 1985 converted an AHM/YUGO Plymouth to HOn3 from HOn2 1/2. ran OK until one of the axle gears cracked. but the Club members didn't like it,and was expecting the Pitchfork Crowd to get me one nite,but they didn't. they did decide to use HOn3 MDC Shays for power until it was discovered that the HO Wide Frame hit almost everthing near the tracks that were spaced for HOn3 Width locos. also made up were some Styrene patterns for boxcars to be mounted on HOn3 PSC molded frames. that sort of ended the adventures in HOn3 here. but the dislike of the Diesel was about the same as the dislike of N&W Blue locos. Spikre 
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Post by bdhicks on Mar 10, 2014 17:08:43 GMT -8
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mecu18b
Full Member
My doctor gave me six months to live, but when I couldn't pay the bill he gave me six months more.
Posts: 146
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Post by mecu18b on Mar 10, 2014 17:25:47 GMT -8
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Post by TBird1958 on Mar 11, 2014 8:34:12 GMT -8
That's pretty cool stuff, I had no idea any of this (or what Mike commented on) was being done, either by the prototype or as models. |
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Post by wvmnut on Dec 19, 2014 21:24:43 GMT -8
Yeah, yeah, I know, technically this is necro-posting, but the West Virginia Midland needs another diesel. The Consol we were using gave up the ghost. We bought an interesting looking beasty from the Oahu RR, which runs fine, but doesn't seem to like Shinohara turnouts worth a flip. Management wants a GE 70-ton conversion, but the mechanical/engineering dept doesn't have the experience to do the job. The OR unit is simply too light to do the work that needs done. Finding a completed conversion has proven fruitless; roads that have them are holding onto them. The last original loco, 4-6-0 #10 is forbidden to do freight work. She's strictly on the passenger runs, Diana to Webster Springs, Webster Springs to Skelt. (The line was of course abandoned past Diana when the dam at Summersville went in and flooded Holly Junction in the late 40's...progress my eye.) SO...if any road happens to have a 70 ton conversion for sale, please contact management here.
And yes...a center cab and a string of EBT hoppers is a thing to behold.
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Post by mlehman on Dec 20, 2014 13:35:41 GMT -8
wvmnut, I have three but need at least one more myself. Given the light weight, they perform better when paired-up as the other one kicks the first along if it stumbles. In six months I might be interested in building you one or more. Gotta get the diss done. I'm within a few weeks of getting the draft finished, things will start slowing down a little and I could consider building more then. It's also helpful to know your locomotive through building it, though. These are good runners once tuned, but they often need close attention during the break-in period. I know my later ones are better runners, which I attribute mostly to learning where I need to be more careful. Even if you're uncertain of your skills, I encourage you to consider building one so long as you have a copy of the Hauff Brothers RMC conversion article. Common hand tools are all that are necessary. I'd be glad to document building one in-depth next time I build, as well as answer questions and give encouragement. That way you'd have a loco at parts cost, plus the capability to build more. On the other hand, with a history degree, building narrowgauge diesels could fill a market niche and my need for employment Have to see about that. BTW, this is the guy to watch for HOn3 diesel conversions: feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=jeepcaptain&ftab=AllFeedbackI see he's sold a couple in the last year, but looks to be a limited offering from him. Maybe keep his store in your ebay Search and have it alert you if he has anything come up? |
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Post by benscaro on Jan 31, 2017 2:12:55 GMT -8
I am interested in which HO Bachmann/Spectrum 44 or 70 tonner trucks can be narrowed? With the first release which has a motor in each truck, it does not look like the truck can be narrowed. I bought a B&M one.
How can one tell when buying a loco whether it is the first release or the second one (which I'm told can be narrowed to 10.5mm.)
How wide are the truck gear towers?
I need to fit the trucks into a narrow gauge hood and there's only 14mm width to play with. Unsure if this is enough for the trucks to swivel corrrectly.
Regards
Ben
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Post by alcoc430 on Jan 31, 2017 8:14:14 GMT -8
I am interested in which HO Bachmann/Spectrum 44 or 70 tonner trucks can be narrowed? With the first release which has a motor in each truck, it does not look like the truck can be narrowed. I bought a B&M one. How can one tell when buying a loco whether it is the first release or the second one (which I'm told can be narrowed to 10.5mm.) How wide are the truck gear towers? I need to fit the trucks into a narrow gauge hood and there's only 14mm width to play with. Unsure if this is enough for the trucks to swivel corrrectly. Regards Ben There are 3 generations of 44/70 ton switchers. The first is the 2 motor, the second and third generation has a single dual shaft motor powering each truck. The wheelsets for the 2nd generation looks like athearn's/proto with the center drive axle gear with 1/2 axle wheels pushed into each side. Of course every loco I had of these had the axle spilt. The parts for the 2nd generation trucks are sold out at Bachmann, but I read that you can epoxy the wheel shaft to the geared axle to prevent slipping. You can tell a 2nd generation in that it has five square holes down the center of the bottom plate of the truck. The third generation has 3 square holes. The wheelsets in the third generation is a solid steel axle across the entire wheel set the gear is pressed on and the wheels have a plastic bushing in them to prevent electrical shorting. The wheel set and worms are not interchangeable between the second and third generation. However, if you replace the entire truck including worm gear then you can mount the third generation truck to a second generation frame. I not sure if it works the other way because the 2nd generation frame has the worms mounted to the frame with screws. So I expect you would have to drill and tap a 3rd generation frame. Edit: You probably can disassemble the 3rd generation wheel set but you would need a little press and a wheel puller. the wheels have through holes so you can push them closer to get the wheel spacing you need. I will try to remember later when I'm home to measure the truck width and post it here. The following is a photo of the 2nd generation wheelset.  Below are pictures from the 3rd generation truck, its the only ones I have left. Note the 3 square holes. Although I don't have the 2nd gen trucks any longer they appeared IIRC to be the very close to the same size just modified to hold the different axle types. The retainer flanges at the top of the truck matched in width as they were interchangeable in the frame.  Note the one piece axle. The wheels have through holes so you may be able to press the wheels into the axle to get the width you need but you may have to modify bearings mounts in the frames   Sorry the dimensions in the photos are in inches, the metric equivalent for the width of the truck frame at axle is 13.13mm.  the width of truck frame in metric is 9.93mm  |
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Post by alcoc430 on Jan 31, 2017 20:03:31 GMT -8
added the photos that show dimensions see above This is the width of the retainer flanges at the top of the truck frame, is 14.08mm +/-  The width of the truck retainer bracket is 13.07mm +/- (not shown0 The frame width is 17.48mm (not shown) |
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Post by benscaro on Feb 1, 2017 3:11:41 GMT -8
Thank you very much, this is really helpful. It looks as though this would not turn easily in a 14mm wide hood space. Ben
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Post by cf7 on Feb 1, 2017 6:07:06 GMT -8
Not that it really matters much anymore..the HOn3 conversion, anyway. NWSL discontinued the wheelsets that are necessary for the conversion. I even tried to buy just the parts so I could assemble them myself. No such luck.
I should have bought more than the 3 that I did.
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Post by benscaro on Feb 1, 2017 13:57:06 GMT -8
Thanks for the advice. It looks too wide for my hood anyway.
A solution may be a TT scale Tillig locomotive but as you probably know, they are not cheap.
Ben
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