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Post by thb401 on Feb 27, 2013 19:27:00 GMT -8
modelrailroadnews.com says a plastic U25C is coming from KBM Lines Korea-Brass. Check under there news section. Bill
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Post by atsfan on Feb 27, 2013 19:29:24 GMT -8
After years as a supplier, Korea-Brass is starting its own line of high quality plastic models with the announcement of its HO Scale model of GE’s U25C. The first in their new KBM Lineup. These locomotives have never been offered with this level of detail and realism in a plastic model ever before. The U25C was GE’s first 6 axle locomotive and, while met with resistance, it would prove the case for all future GE high horsepower 6 axle road diesels that would follow. These highly detailed models will feature razor sharp painting with prototypical paint schemes, separately applied details such as grab irons, ladders and handrails and premium operating knuckle couplers. They will be available with high quality sound and an integral DCC decoder that feature correct operating Mars lights where applicable for ready-to-roll operation or DCC and sound ready so you can choose your own decoder and speaker options. Multiple roadnumbers will be available for the following roadnames: Atlantic Coast Lines; Seaboard Coast Lines; Chicago, Burlington and Quincy; Northern Pacific; Burlington Northern; Louisville and Nashville; SCL/L&N Family Lines; Pennsylvania; PennCentral; Conrail; and Lake Superior and Ishpeming. The estimated MSRP is $290 to $315 for sound equipped DCC versions and around $190 for the sound ready/DCC ready models. Delivery is expected in the 1st quarter of 2014. Dates for Pre-orders will be announced later as will our list of participating Dealers.
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Post by atsfan on Feb 27, 2013 19:33:25 GMT -8
"And I would say the odds of every U-boat version being offered in mass produced plastic has got to be fairly close to that of a horse and buggy in everybody's driveway."
Better get the manure forks out............:-)
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Post by curtmc on Feb 27, 2013 19:41:03 GMT -8
Frank, you obviously missed the word "every" in that quote... Still several more that are more of a long shot than the U25C (that the American manufacturers have the financial sense to skip. and that could be the beginning of Korean vaporware)...
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Post by theengineshed on Feb 27, 2013 19:58:06 GMT -8
Never say never. Just thanking god it wasn't a Walthers production...
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Post by wendtsc on Feb 27, 2013 23:44:58 GMT -8
Some of the reasons that we decided to join the market were a concern that some good potential products were falling by the siding, would we have something to fall back on if some of our current partners had to trim some of their business, and we wanted to have something in our own line to help jump start the hobby here in Korea. When we looked at the potential candidates for our first release as a model under our own banner we considered the following. There weren't that many prototype families that had never been done in high quality plastic. We didn't want to choose something that everyone else already has a version of on the market. If we announced we were entering the market with an SD40-2 or an SD70-ACE, who would care? Also, would there be a future potential to use some of the castings and assemblies in future model releases? The U25C fit those requirements. While it wasn't the biggest seller from GE by a long shot, it shared many features (including the FDL-16) and contributed to the success of many new locos from GE. We will be able to adapt the trucks, the cab, much of the body as well as the mechanism and sound files for possible future models like a U25B (same length), U28C or a U28B. And for all of those who continually say it will never happen because if wasn't a big model in the US, remember that many of us manufacturers are global. Some of those rare Alcos and MLWs were used or copied by foreign companies. (So take heart.) For those who are worried about us not being able to deliver, we have been in the business since 1986 and can almost guarantee, whether you know it or not, if you own more than two locomotives, either steam or diesel, plastic, brass or die cast, in Gauge 1, HO, HO-AC or O 3-rail, based on an American, European, or Japanese, there is a better than 50-50 chance that one of them was built by us! As my friends back home in Spooner, WI would say, "This is not exactly our first rodeo!" Even though the lifespan of the model was kind of short (roughly, 1963 to about 1984) and they had low numbers, they were bought by several class 1s right before the rash of mergers in the 60s and 70s, so almost every single one wore two or three different paint schemes during its brief lifetime. If you look at our press release, you can see we have a lot of different paint schemes that we can spread production over and the railroads that owned them cover just about the entire US. And because there were so few and they lived such quick lives, we can do pretty accurate models without having to worry as much about all the rebuilds and modifications that usually make it extremely difficult to get it right. We also wanted something that would grab everyone's attention. Considering our announcement is only 3 hours old and it has already spread to 4 different forums, been shared to over 40 different Facebook pages and had almost 200 comments, and considering the time of day and how small the model railroading community is to begin with, we are pretty confident at this point. We only sent the release to one publisher. And finally, after all the discussion we had about the U25C, we still waited until we got some solid data back. For that, we would like to thank a member of this forum, Robert Simpson, who decided to use his years of experience in market consulting to the benefit of our hobby. And also to all of you who participated in his survey. Considering that the U25C was on the list of a third of the participants, and the sample was as good as the ones used by MSNBC during the last election , the future looks pretty good, as long as the economy improves. That's why the 2014 release. It gives people extra time to save. Scott Wendt Director of Sales and New Market Development Korea-Brass Co., Ltd. www.korea-brass.com/new/english/index
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Post by mkulak on Feb 28, 2013 0:54:46 GMT -8
Congrats to KBM Lines for jumping into the US Model Railroading jungle so to speak and good luck on your first Model the U25C. It is a needed model and long overdue. I hope you are still interested in doing the modern Tropicana Reefers that many of us Eastern Modern Modelers are waiting for(not the BLMA Foobie) As said in a previous post if you make them I will buy! Just please if you do anything stay away from the following models, F7, 40' single door boxcars, and 2 bay coal hoppers There are enough of these out there to fill a small country from end to end Hope to see/buy many good things in the future from you and good luck!
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Post by nw611 on Feb 28, 2013 3:06:27 GMT -8
Korea Brass is the company making most of BLI engines (steam and diesel). I think they also made the Fox Valley Hiawatha 4-4-2 locomotive. Ciao. Raffaele
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Post by scl1234 on Feb 28, 2013 4:48:37 GMT -8
You've hit on most of the reasons why a high-quality version of this model is still unproduced in plastic. Couple the above with the high expectations modelers have for a >$300 DCC-ready locomotive (prototype scarcity and rampant money printing raises the price, folks), and you have your work cut out for you business-plan wise. Be sure to check out past version(s) of the SCL Modeler at www.aclsal.org for an article about a highly detailed U25C built-up by Carl Marchand (if I recall correctly) from an old AHM unit. These articles will be a good starting point for your product marketing efforts.
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Post by riogrande on Feb 28, 2013 5:14:17 GMT -8
Scott,
Thank you for your informative and interesting discussion of your new announcement. As a western fan of the 70's and 80's, I look forward to seeing what you bring to the market in the coming months and years. I wish you success with the U25C project - it sounds like you've thought this through very well and it has alot of potential!
Cheers, Jim Fitch (from sequesterland in northern Virginia)
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Post by carrman on Feb 28, 2013 5:30:37 GMT -8
I hope that KBM makes a successful go of it. But please, no radical drive mechanisms, or strange gear ratios. We want something that plays well with others! Put me down for a BN or two.....
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Post by carrman on Feb 28, 2013 5:33:27 GMT -8
One other thing, please don't view the BLI SD40-2 as something to live up to. Surpass it, please!
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Post by trebor on Feb 28, 2013 7:00:27 GMT -8
YEE HAAA YEEE HAAAA YEEE HAAA (Slim Pickins style). The statement made that the U25C was "only around for " 20 years is not only laughable , but proves that a model is a no brainer. There were also many paint schemes in many roads that far out number other units that are whined for by others. Like the C6xx and C4xx these are likely to be far more popular than the prototype numbers indicate.
Personally, I will probably go nuts on these as they fit my era and setting to a T. PRR, PC, CR, NP, BN, CB&Q, and maybe an L&N Too. (Hey that rhymes!).
If and when these become a reality, I can canabalize my Rivarrossi's whithout heart break to repower my ALCO Models E44's.
Bob
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Post by carrman on Feb 28, 2013 7:13:21 GMT -8
The thought of a possible U25B also tickles me. Bye bye rehashed Stewarts.
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Post by atsfan on Feb 28, 2013 8:21:44 GMT -8
Frank, you obviously missed the word "every" in that quote... Still several more that are more of a long shot than the U25C (that the American manufacturers have the financial sense to skip. and that could be the beginning of Korean vaporware)... Still not Frank, but I am happy this engine is coming. Based on "every", I guess we will need to wait 10 years before the statement is proven not accurate. In the meantime let's enjoy the hobby. There are no "American Manufacturers". None. They import from China and Korea, who are the manufacturers. Makes perfect sense to cut out the importers and their overhead. Vaporware? We will see in a year. May be, may not be. Too soon to tell.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2013 8:26:38 GMT -8
A U25C at a top tier price from a second tier manufacturer. Oh boy!
Going on past products from this manufacturer, through BLI, I'll take a wait and see attitude. Like Bowser with the someday C636 and C430, I hope for the best, but expect so-so. We can file this announcement in the "someday" file too.
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Post by el3637 on Feb 28, 2013 8:30:35 GMT -8
One other thing, please don't view the BLI SD40-2 as something to live up to. Surpass it, please! The BLI SD40-2 is lame even up against Athearn's 30 year old tooling. If this is what we have to look forward to in a U25C, I'm not interested. The only BLI diesel I own is an RSD15, and only because I have nothing better to compare it to. Is KBM capable of doing better than what we've seen from BLI and PCM so far? Let's hope so. Andy
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Post by el3637 on Feb 28, 2013 8:34:12 GMT -8
of many new locos from GE. We will be able to adapt the trucks, the cab, much of the body as well as the mechanism and sound files for possible future models like a U25B (same length) If you think a U25B is the same length as a U25C, you're already scaring me. Andy
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Post by carrman on Feb 28, 2013 8:41:43 GMT -8
Frank, you obviously missed the word "every" in that quote... Still several more that are more of a long shot than the U25C (that the American manufacturers have the financial sense to skip. and that could be the beginning of Korean vaporware)... Still not Frank, but I am happy this engine is coming. Based on "every", I guess we will need to wait 10 years before the statement is proven not accurate. In the meantime let's enjoy the hobby. There are no "American Manufacturers". None. They import from China and Korea, who are the manufacturers. Makes perfect sense to cut out the importers and their overhead. Vaporware? We will see in a year. May be, may not be. Too soon to tell. Kadee manufactures model rr prodcut about 3 miles from my house, I even live on the same street as they are. Microtrains makes trains about 15 miles from my house. All of us are in the US.
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Post by calzephyr on Feb 28, 2013 8:48:42 GMT -8
modelrailroadnews.com says a plastic U25C is coming from KBM Lines Korea-Brass. Check under there news section. Bill Bill Do you know if this is the same builder that got into the problem with the lawsuit between MTH and Lionel over using the same tooling for the two companies? Their products are very good and run well and if they offer products for our market, the models should be nice overall. The price seems to be high but will probably be discounted. Larry
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Post by calzephyr on Feb 28, 2013 8:58:07 GMT -8
Some of the reasons that we decided to join the market were a concern that some good potential products were falling by the siding, would we have something to fall back on if some of our current partners had to trim some of their business, and we wanted to have something in our own line to help jump start the hobby here in Korea. When we looked at the potential candidates for our first release as a model under our own banner we considered the following. There weren't that many prototype families that had never been done in high quality plastic. We didn't want to choose something that everyone else already has a version of on the market. If we announced we were entering the market with an SD40-2 or an SD70-ACE, who would care? Also, would there be a future potential to use some of the castings and assemblies in future model releases? The U25C fit those requirements. While it wasn't the biggest seller from GE by a long shot, it shared many features (including the FDL-16) and contributed to the success of many new locos from GE. We will be able to adapt the trucks, the cab, much of the body as well as the mechanism and sound files for possible future models like a U25B (same length), U28C or a U28B. And for all of those who continually say it will never happen because if wasn't a big model in the US, remember that many of us manufacturers are global. Some of those rare Alcos and MLWs were used or copied by foreign companies. (So take heart.) For those who are worried about us not being able to deliver, we have been in the business since 1986 and can almost guarantee, whether you know it or not, if you own more than two locomotives, either steam or diesel, plastic, brass or die cast, in Gauge 1, HO, HO-AC or O 3-rail, based on an American, European, or Japanese, there is a better than 50-50 chance that one of them was built by us! As my friends back home in Spooner, WI would say, "This is not exactly our first rodeo!" Even though the lifespan of the model was kind of short (roughly, 1963 to about 1984) and they had low numbers, they were bought by several class 1s right before the rash of mergers in the 60s and 70s, so almost every single one wore two or three different paint schemes during its brief lifetime. If you look at our press release, you can see we have a lot of different paint schemes that we can spread production over and the railroads that owned them cover just about the entire US. And because there were so few and they lived such quick lives, we can do pretty accurate models without having to worry as much about all the rebuilds and modifications that usually make it extremely difficult to get it right. We also wanted something that would grab everyone's attention. Considering our announcement is only 3 hours old and it has already spread to 4 different forums, been shared to over 40 different Facebook pages and had almost 200 comments, and considering the time of day and how small the model railroading community is to begin with, we are pretty confident at this point. We only sent the release to one publisher. And finally, after all the discussion we had about the U25C, we still waited until we got some solid data back. For that, we would like to thank a member of this forum, Robert Simpson, who decided to use his years of experience in market consulting to the benefit of our hobby. And also to all of you who participated in his survey. Considering that the U25C was on the list of a third of the participants, and the sample was as good as the ones used by MSNBC during the last election , the future looks pretty good, as long as the economy improves. That's why the 2014 release. It gives people extra time to save. Scott Wendt Director of Sales and New Market Development Korea-Brass Co., Ltd. www.korea-brass.com/new/english/indexScott Thanks for posting the information. I own many of your products if you built the early on BLI and PCM models and they are some of the better running model trains that I have. Your company probably built the past hybrid brass also for BLI. Is that correct?? Anyway, nice to have you on board our forum and I wish you all the success with this new plastic model. Are you still producing brass models?? Thanks Larry
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cmarchan
New Member
Amtrak SDP40Fs - we GOT them!
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Post by cmarchan on Feb 28, 2013 9:04:56 GMT -8
Be sure to check out past version(s) of the SCL Modeler at www.aclsal.org for an article about a highly detailed U25C built-up by Carl Marchand (if I recall correctly) from an old AHM unit. These articles will be a good starting point for your product marketing efforts. The credit for the best U25C model I've ever seen goes to Bill McCoy. He created the article for this unit from an old AHM model, upgraded walkways and grilles from photo etched parts, new cab and a drive train (from Kaslo). I retrofitted an Athearn U36B and wrote an article for it in the same magazine, different issue. Carl Marchand
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Post by trebor on Feb 28, 2013 9:07:22 GMT -8
The only common parts to a U25B and U25C would likely be coupler, coupler boxes, decoder when equiped, a few horNs, light bulbs, screws and maybe the window glass.
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Post by theengineshed on Feb 28, 2013 9:21:58 GMT -8
A U25C at a top tier price from a second tier manufacturer. Oh boy! Going on past products from this manufacturer, through BLI, I'll take a wait and see attitude. SD40-2 aside, which I own none, the Centipedes and latest run RSDs seemed to hit my spot. I don't agree with the second tier labeling... I'm certainly game for some U25Cs and look forward to seeing what comes of this. I'm also grateful for Scott coming to the forum and explaining K-Bs plans.
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Post by middledivision on Feb 28, 2013 10:24:58 GMT -8
As a Pennsy fan, I have lusted for a quality U25C for many years. I wish you good luck with the project. However, I'm not a fan of operating couplers.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Feb 28, 2013 10:31:59 GMT -8
i think it would be ever so wise of KBM to show a test casting ASAP because:
It will show a physical product. Although they've done a whole lot through BLI, this will be their first under their own name. Confidence needs to be built. Sales will go up.
It will show how wonderful it is. And I do hope it will be wonderful. Sales will go up.
Mistakes that got through the folks at KBM may well be caught by we civilians before production starts. Recall, please, the Athearn GP9 unpleasantness. Sales will not go down.
Note the unifying theme.
Ed
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Post by dti406 on Feb 28, 2013 10:39:08 GMT -8
I am hoping this project succeeds and the model is worth the money that will be spent on it. I would really like the PRR version along with the LS&I which the DT&I leased at times during the winter ore season.
Rick J
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Post by ambluco on Feb 28, 2013 11:10:48 GMT -8
I'd like an ex-SCL, NdeM painted one.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Feb 28, 2013 11:21:56 GMT -8
Here's a roster of U25C's: www.trainweb.org/jaydeet/u25c.htmThere's 3 1/2 phases. I wonder if KBM is doing 4 different versions, or just one. And which one. I note that there's also road specific details that could be added, especially the various thingys on and behind the cab roof. I wonder if those will be applied by KBM. There's an assortment of see-through grills on these locos. I wonder if they will be see-through one the model. Scott? ?? Ed
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Post by atsfan on Feb 28, 2013 12:13:45 GMT -8
Still not Frank, but I am happy this engine is coming. Based on "every", I guess we will need to wait 10 years before the statement is proven not accurate. In the meantime let's enjoy the hobby. There are no "American Manufacturers". None. They import from China and Korea, who are the manufacturers. Makes perfect sense to cut out the importers and their overhead. Vaporware? We will see in a year. May be, may not be. Too soon to tell. Kadee manufactures model rr prodcut about 3 miles from my house, I even live on the same street as they are. Microtrains makes trains about 15 miles from my house. All of us are in the US. I am referring to HO engines. The last one I know of that manufactured with Stewart. Now made in China and imported by Bowser.
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