A&W boxcars

[keystonefarm]

Both General Mills and Pillsbury leased 40' box cars from the Atlantic and Western to make up for the lack of Buffalo Creek cars for their flour shipments. Since I model part of Buffalo I thought it would be nice to add a few to my XM fleet . K-4 decals makes the needed decals but the question I have is what 40' box cars to use and what color are the cars. They look to be either a pale yellow or a ivory white. Multiple color pictures show multiple colors . Any idea what car and color to use for my 6 car A&W fleet ? --- Ken

[Mr. Trainiac]

tom has done a model of this car in the past on this forum: atlasrescueforum.proboards.com/thread/8786/photos-atlantic-western-boxcar

He got the color pretty close, I'd say the car is closer to white than it is yellow. Those yellow cars may have been color-shifted or faded slides.

Here's a 50 foot car, but this still looks like a good photo to use as a color reference: flic.kr/p/h8zEn8

[tom]

At first I was thinking it was a question on something like this:



Thanks for posting the link to my ATW car. As noted I used antique white for my car and I am still happy with that choice of color.

[wagnersteve]

4/28/2024, starting about 8:18 a.m., EDT

Branchline decorated a MDC Roundhouse 40' modernized boxcar for the Atlantic & Western. The one I bought July 29, 1998 at its full list price of $10.75 and put together the same evening, adding Kadee #5 couplers and 33" wheelsets, is ATW 6106, with markings including XF, WA 6-76 and "WHEN EMPTY RETURN TO AGENT BCK RR BUFFALO NY". I had seen at least one similar full-sized car. The odd herald or logo struck me as resembling a cross section of some kind of machine more than an AW! This was one of the several very colorful 40-cars that I recall seeing in the 1970s. Athearn models of "modernized" AAR 1937 design cars include ACL, EL and LNAC cars; a similar MDC Roundhouse model replicates an ex-EL D&H XF car. These models have some flaws, having side sills and/or ladders that need to be revised. An Athearn AAR 1937 design car that isn't modernized wears the same Port Huron & Detroit mostly blue livery the "St. Clair Blue Water Route" used on longer cars; again, I think that was quite accurate.

[champagnetrail]

Apr 27, 2024 20:53:04 GMT -8 keystonefarm said:

Both General Mills and Pillsbury leased 40' box cars from the Atlantic and Western to make up for the lack of Buffalo Creek cars for their flour shipments. Since I model part of Buffalo I thought it would be nice to add a few to my XM fleet . K-4 decals makes the needed decals but the question I have is what 40' box cars to use and what color are the cars. They look to be either a pale yellow or a ivory white. Multiple color pictures show multiple colors . Any idea what car and color to use for my 6 car A&W fleet ? --- Ken

The ATW cars are USRE rebuilds, which might have come from several donor types, so you have to look at photos to determine the best starting point. For example, the one done by Tom was a PS-1, and the photos that I have found after a quick look on the web are all PS-1.  Changing the side sill will go a long way toward making a good model.  I've always thought the color was more ivory than yellow, and think that Tom nailed the color on his model.

-pat

[keystonefarm]

Thanks for the link to Tom's car . Antique white with some tan it is. I'll use some PS-1's as my start. ------ Ken

[lvrr325]

USRE rebuilt 40' cars are something I wish someone like Tangent would tackle. I would think you could pick a couple of more common source cars, tool the basic shell with the rebuild upgrades, and then use doors, etc. to match photos to come up with several numbers of each paint scheme offered. But I've never looked into them to see if the upgrades evolve over time, either.

I would get both LV and A&W cars at a minimum, likely a TP&W or two also.

[cpr4200]

IIRC, NYC, LV, and MEC had similar USRE 40' rebuilds. Not a hard kitbash, but it would be nice to have in RTR.

[Colin 't Hart]

Apr 29, 2024 6:49:51 GMT -8 cpr4200 said:

IIRC, NYC, LV, and MEC had similar USRE 40' rebuilds. Not a hard kitbash, but it would be nice to have in RTR.

Never say never but I seriously doubt we'll see these done RTR. There was little commonality between them. Different ends (dreadnought and PS), differing numbers of panels, welded and riveted cars, different door sizes. Even the strengthened sill wasn't a feature common to all rebuilds.
Some roads didn't even just get their own cars rebuilt: they traded in some cars and got back some rebuilt cars, but there was no guarantee which cars ended up where. USRE just treated the cars as source material for the rebuilds.

[dti406]

I also did one of the ATW cars, but used the Herald King Decals as the K4 ones were not out when I did the car. After consulting with my artist daughter I made the Ivory paint out of White with a little yellow, blue and red paints.



Rick Jesionowski

[drolsen]

Apr 28, 2024 11:37:48 GMT -8 champagnetrail said:

I've always thought the color was more ivory than yellow, and think that Tom nailed the color on his model.

It’s always interesting how we each perceive colors, based on our individual frame of reference. As a CSX modeler, I always thought the A&W color looked very similar to the beige that Family Lines (later CSX) applied to covered hoppers, as shown on these Tangent models (images from a Tangent announcement posted here a few years ago):





To my eye, I think A&W boxcars look just the way those covered hoppers do after they faded for a few years. I agree that Tom nailed it by adding some tan to his white color.

Dave

[cpr4200]

Apr 27, 2024 20:53:04 GMT -8 keystonefarm said:

Both General Mills and Pillsbury leased 40' box cars from the Atlantic and Western to make up for the lack of Buffalo Creek cars for their flour shipments.

Does this mean there were not enough BCK cars to handle the business, or that the BCK cars were gone? I seem to remember EL boxcars marked XF in the 70's.

[keystonefarm]

May 3, 2024 8:56:18 GMT -8 cpr4200 said:

Apr 27, 2024 20:53:04 GMT -8 keystonefarm said:

Both General Mills and Pillsbury leased 40' box cars from the Atlantic and Western to make up for the lack of Buffalo Creek cars for their flour shipments.

Does this mean there were not enough BCK cars to handle the business, or that the BCK cars were gone? I seem to remember EL boxcars marked XF in the 70's.

The BCK was jointly owned by the EL and LV before Conrail. Both owners were having their own financial issues and the BCK had a bunch of their cars OOS due to needed repair. So the big customers General Mills and Pillsbury leased the ATW cars to supplement the existing BCK supply. Conrail ended up with the BCK and scrapped the remainder of the 40' BCK fleet. Most of the flour loading facilities were designed for 40' cars so while newer 50' cars could be used the door spacings made it much more work.

[lvrr325]

Some Buffalo Creek cars were returned to the LV, too, they got the reporting mark changed and little else. It's not unusual to see in photos BCK cars in terrible shape, with the paint largely gone and the lettering barely visible.

[wagnersteve]

5/3/2024, starting about 6:35 p.m., EDT

I have strong memories of seeing Buffalo Creek 40' boxcars with the circular herald with the flour bag in PRR and Reading freight yards in Philadelphia in t950s, while riding the Frankford Elevated and other public transit lines. One of the first decaling I did on an HO car was using Champ decals on an AHM car body. I later used a dry transfer set to improve part of the graphics. More recently I've acquired four Kadee BCK boxcars with two styles of doors.

[Mr. Trainiac]

I found a bit more information on the Atlantic and Western boxcars. There is a page in Freight Car Journal 78 with a few photos: dgcasdor.ipower.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/fcj78.pdf

David Casdorph has most of the FCJ magazines digitized on his website. He was the editor or writer for most of that publication.

[wagnersteve]

5/29/2024, about 4:16 p.m., EDT

Mr. Trainiac, thanks very much for your post from two days ago. Very useful.

[Mr. Trainiac]

May 29, 2024 12:16:38 GMT -8 wagnersteve said:

5/29/2024, about 4:16 p.m., EDT

Mr. Trainiac, thanks very much for your post from two days ago. Very useful.

My friend sent me a link to his website last weekend, so I spent a few hours scrolling through all the issues looking for reference photos and project ideas. David's research into freight car rosters is impressive. Some of the Freight Car Journals are more prototype focused with less emphasis on modeling potential, but the amount of technical and clerical information he has been able to find is amazing.

I've come across individual issues of Freight Car Journal before, but it's pretty generous for him to digitize all the magazines and put them on his website for free. Plenty of other publishers would charge for a CD or digital download.

[cpr4200]

What is the url for Casdorph's website? I googled it and only found a link to his print-on-demand book catalog.

[keystonefarm]

Mr Trainiac thank you very much for the photos !! It looks like a 3D printing project to me !! I'm the original poster. More info is better !! --- Ken

[Mr. Trainiac]

May 29, 2024 18:33:12 GMT -8 cpr4200 said:

What is the url for Casdorph's website? I googled it and only found a link to his print-on-demand book catalog.

This is the link to the main page, the magazines are in the Freight Car Journal tab on the left: dgcasdor.ipower.com/dgcasdorph/

I'm assuming this is an official website that he created. There are a few other people listed in the credits who seem geniune. Hopefully I'm not promoting a fruadulent website that reproduced the issues without permission.

[keystonefarm]

I emailed 3D last night and asked Matt about doing some USRE 40' boxcars . He sent me a photo of three cars currently in process so it looks like we will be getting some 3D printed USRE cars !! ------- Ken

[drolsen]

May 30, 2024 15:12:57 GMT -8 Mr. Trainiac said:

This is the link to the main page, the magazines are in the Freight Car Journal tab on the left: dgcasdor.ipower.com/dgcasdorph/

I'm assuming this is an official website that he created. There are a few other people listed in the credits who seem geniune. Hopefully I'm not promoting a fruadulent website that reproduced the issues without permission.

No, that's definitely his website. It's been around for at least a decade (maybe two?) in some form or another. The address has remained the same, but he's updated the format over time.

Dave

[cpr4200]

Great info there. Thank you for the link. ~ Walt