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Post by riggelweg on May 19, 2012 17:27:58 GMT -8
I have a Stewart F3 that I picked up in the mid to late 1990s, I think, although I can't really remember when I got it. I love the drive, but the shell and the paint job are lacking. It's painted for the Reading.
On each side, the stripe should be continuous. Obviously, they were applied in two separate operations per side (one operation to apply the stripe along the flat portion of the side, and one to complete it at the nose). The result is that there is a discontinuity where the side transitions to the nose, and a bit of the stripe continues to the fore while the portion of the stripe applied to the nose bends down. The result is a jagged, odd looking stripe at this transition point. The transition has the shape of a switch, when it should look like a smooth line that bends.
Long story short: I'd like to repaint the thing. While I'm at it, I think I might just replace the shell with a Highliner shell. Does anyone know if this is possible?
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Post by el3637 on May 19, 2012 23:08:00 GMT -8
Long story short: I'd like to repaint the thing. While I'm at it, I think I might just replace the shell with a Highliner shell. Does anyone know if this is possible? I have not put a Highliners shell on a Stewart drive, but it has been done by many from the days of the B unit kit long before the A unit or Genesis drives existed. Intermountain's F shell was designed specifically to fit the Stewart drive, until they came out with their own drive a year or two later. Anyway, it's definitely doable and probably not too difficult. I think Athearn's snap mounting system is similar but perhaps not identical. The main issue with the Stewart drive is that it sits a bit too high, but you can fix this fairly easily by filing down the tops of the truck bolsters, or not worry about it if it doesn't bother you. Actually all of the F units including Intermountain sit too high, so you'd only notice if you put it next to a Genesis. Andy |
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Post by tom on May 20, 2012 3:58:43 GMT -8
As Andy said the Highliner shell was made to fit on the Stewart drive. Athearn did not tweek the mounting system because the Highliner shell kit is still the original version.....and the Athearn/Genesis is still the same.
The shell attaches to the Stewart drive by the tabs on the porthole window castings. I insert the these castings into the shell then add small tabs of tape to keep them from flopping around while inserting the shell.
The shell does ride a little high but all I do is slice off the small little rounds of plastic where the trucks interface with the frame. This allows the frame to sit a little lower and makes it good enough for me.
I have found that the 25 year old Stewart mechanisms run better than than the Athearn/Genesis mechanisms.
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2012 4:57:13 GMT -8
Athearn did not tweek the mounting system because the Highliner shell kit is still the original version.....and the Athearn/Genesis is still the same. This statement is only partially correct. The first couple of years of the Athearn Genesis drive for the Highliner shell used the window clip to attach the shell to the frame. For at least the last five years and maybe more, Athearn has highly modified the Genesis drive and the mounting system for the Highliner shell to the drive. The window insert is totally gone replaced by L-brackets glued to the rear door and a snap in coupler carrier for the front of the A-unit. The current Genesis drive is mounted to the Highliner shell by screws. YOU CAN NOT USE THE STEWART PORTHOLE WINDOW CLIP TO MOUNT THE SHELL TO THE CHASSIS WITHOUT GLUING IT. THE PORTHOLE WINDOWS ON THE STEWART ARE SLIGHTLY SMALLER THAN THE HIGHLINER |
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Post by riogrande on May 20, 2012 4:58:42 GMT -8
What Tom said rings true for me too. Back in the day when Lubliner was first tooling the Highliner F shells, it was tooled to use existing drives so modelers could buy the shell, assemble the phase version they wished and mount it on existing drives. At that time, the major drives available would have been Stewart and Athearn. Stewart were the superior drive of course, so the shell should fit.
The Stewart drives were originally tooled and made by KATO, and everyone knows how KATO's run! =P. I have 17 original Stewarts bought 15 to 20 years ago and they run sweet, and even though the shells are a bit dated compared to the Genesis, I'm keeping them. I've noticed that Stewart F unit's depsite their slightly dated shell, still hold value because the drives are so awesome.
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Post by calzephyr on May 20, 2012 5:24:17 GMT -8
What Tom said rings true for me too. Back in the day when Lubliner was first tooling the Highliner F shells, it was tooled to use existing drives so modelers could buy the shell, assemble the phase version they wished and mount it on existing drives. At that time, the major drives available would have been Stewart and Athearn. Stewart were the superior drive of course, so the shell should fit. The Stewart drives were originally tooled and made by KATO, and everyone knows how KATO's run! =P. I have 17 original Stewarts bought 15 to 20 years ago and they run sweet, and even though the shells are a bit dated compared to the Genesis, I'm keeping them. I've noticed that Stewart F unit's depsite their slightly dated shell, still hold value because the drives are so awesome. The first Stewart F units are still my favorite drives since KATO built them and they still run like a KATO even today. My Stewart KATO built drives are all under Highliner shells so the best of the best are together. From what I know, the later Stewarts ran good also but were not built by KATO, probably just a knock off copy of the original. Larry |
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Post by riogrande on May 20, 2012 6:07:02 GMT -8
I have heard that the latter day Stewart drives produced after Steve had the tooling moved over the US were also good runners. Folks reported they ran as well or better. I think I only have one of those drives, possibly too - all presently in storage.
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Post by riggelweg on May 20, 2012 8:02:24 GMT -8
Thanks, everyone. Your answers were most helpful. I guess I'll give it a try. I'll post pictures, although it might be a few months. I need to buy a new airbrush. Anyways, here's a picture of the F3A I was writing about. I had to wait until today to take a decent picture, as I don't have a light box constructed yet.  It's not a bad looking shell (even though I never added the grab irons, horn, etc.). I figure that rather than repainting or attempting to remove the stripe, I'd just start over with a new shell. Also, thanks Andy and Tom for mentioning that the frame sits high. I've never compared it to a Genesis, so I guess I didn't notice. I'll fix this as well. Peter |
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Post by riogrande on May 20, 2012 8:32:12 GMT -8
Picture is blocked at work, but Stewart F's are pretty nice. Stewart F shells dress up well, especially if you can strip the paint and do a little prep work. The sides of the nose to have some mold lines, which are visible, more or less depending on the model and paint. I've seen articles where people have taken them and sanded the mold lines down so they are invisible, and then painted the shell. The molded on side grills look quite good actually, if not shiny like the etched versions. Add some details and then weather them and the Stewart shells can look quite nice. I've always been pleased with the proportions and the windshields look as good as the Proto 2000 and Genesis units, and far exceed the Proto 2000 E units of the day.
According to the articles I read by Jim Six in MRG mag, he did note the chassis sits a little high, so if this bothers you I recall that he mentioned the truck assemblies have a plastic button or nub that allows the trucks to rock and pivot for better tracking on uneven track. I think he just filed that down and it got the chassis close to the correct height. It may be that the chassis were scaled close to correct and the nub added later when it was felt it could help, and this may have raised it above ideal height.
(I wonder if Jim has been back to Atlas and found the rescue forum here?)
Long before the new FP7A units were produced by IMR and Genesis, I think it was Jim Six, who did an article on taking a Stewart and hacking off the front just behind the cab doors and splicing it onto an Atlas FP7A body, because the Atlas nose and windhields never have been up to par. The biggest issue I recall were the batton strips on the bottom didn't line up due to scaling differences between the shells. Anyhow, it was an interesting artcle, and demonstrated how nicely the Stewart nose looked, and IMO, still holds up quite well. Probably the biggest detraction on the Stewarts vs modern HQ F units are the lack of the etched metal parts and details, and the mold lines on the sides of the nose. Again, for those who put a little work into them, the Stewarts can be made to look almost as good as the Genesis and the chassis run like swiss watches. Even adding some details to the Stewarts make them look decent.
I have retained 10 4-stripe D&RGW Stewart F7's for purposes of modeling the mid/late-1960's era when Rio Grande ran them in interesting lashups across the Utah desert during their last hurrah in 4-stripe paint. The error in the striping across the roof can be hidden by covering the roof with a layer of black soot as they appeared in scenes filmed by Emery Gulash in RG Odyssey. By 1967, few F7's were left in 4-stripe paint and to add to that, D&RGW was starting to trade in F7's in ernest on purchases of new GP40's. All of the FT's and F3's had been sent back to La Grange as trade-in's on GP30/GP35/GP50's by around Jan 1966. The 1962-1971 period was Rio Grande's 1st/2nd generation diesel transition period if you consider the GP20/GP30 the beginning of the whole sale unit replacement of the first generation power.
IIRC, only one or two F7's lasted long enough to see the start of the Rio Grande Zephyr. I've seen a few photo's of F7A 5761 or 5764 pulling the RGZ in it's first year of operation. It's a shame the D&RGW didn't retain a second A unit. F7A's 5761 and 5762 were part of the set that included F9B's 5762 and 5763 (the two B units that pulled the RGZ from 1971 - retirement in 1984. Number set #5761-5764 was actually an F7A/F9B/F9B/F7A ABBA set that pulled the California Zephyr during it's final 4 years after the F3's were retired. Rio Grande purchased 6 F9's, two A's and 4 B's, and two of the B's were matched up with F7A's back when they were purchased in the mid-1950's. Apparently Rio Grande's last two F7 sets purchased were ABA sets meant for helper service, so one of the B units was renumbered to create F7ABBA set #5751, 5752, 57 53, 5754, leaving F7A's 5761/5764 to inherit the two spare F9B units which eventually became part of the famous and much photographed F9ABB set! I bet you couldn't sleep without knowing that!
The other two B units which were originally matched with RGZ F9A 5771 were both wrecked between 1965 and 1968. As best I could tell, it looks like one of the F9B units might have been spliced into F3ABBA set #5521/5522/5523/5524 photographed wrecked and in a creek on their sides after the California Zephyr wrecked on spring run off washed out trackage in 1965. That instantly retired the 19 year old F3 set. The other two F9's A unit 5774 and the other B were wrecked around Sept/Oct 1968, leaving only F9ABB 5771, 5762, 5763 left after fall 1968. I believe the F9A 5771 was paired up with a mix of steam generator equipped F7B's such as 5572, 5573, 5552, 5553, or 5562, 5563 that had Farr Air grills installed to match the phase II F7's and F9's.
It would be awesome if Athearn Genesis would offer some latter day D&RGW CZ F units like F7's 5571, 5574. Number 5571 was an F7 wrecked and rebuilt to have F9A side details similar to F9m (F3A #5531) - I'll try to post a picture later of the Genesis model. If one replaced the squirrel cage db fan of the F3 with the axial 36" db fan, one could model #5571 from the F9m Genesis model. F7A 5774 was a standard phase 1 F7 in single tripe paint, but during the last few years it had F3 style roof fans. Several D&RGW F7's ended up with F3 tall roof fans in latter years making for interesting diesels.
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Post by tom on May 20, 2012 8:57:53 GMT -8
[/quote] This statement is only partially correct. The first couple of years of the Athearn Genesis drive for the Highliner shell used the window clip to attach the shell to the frame. For at least the last five years and maybe more, Athearn has highly modified the Genesis drive and the mounting system for the Highliner shell to the drive. The window insert is totally gone replaced by L-brackets glued to the rear door and a snap in coupler carrier for the front of the A-unit. The current Genesis drive is mounted to the Highliner shell by screws. YOU CAN NOT USE THE STEWART PORTHOLE WINDOW CLIP TO MOUNT THE SHELL TO THE CHASSIS WITHOUT GLUING IT. THE PORTHOLE WINDOWS ON THE STEWART ARE SLIGHTLY SMALLER THAN THE HIGHLINER[/quote] I think what I meant to say was that Athearn did not change the original Highliner shell molds. The Athearn frame may have changed but we are talking about the Stewart shell. You CAN use the Stewart porthole window clip to mount the shell without gluing it in place. I know because mine are not glued in and the highliner shell sits securely to the Stewart frame fine.  |
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Post by riggelweg on May 20, 2012 9:00:07 GMT -8
Thanks for your very detailed reply. The picture is hosted on Photobucket. It's also blocked at my place of employment.
The Stewart shell does have mold lines on the nose, and I do agree that the grills look pretty good. I don't have too many complaints about the shell.
I suppose that if I am to go to the trouble of sanding off the mold lines, I might as just start over with a Highliner shell. It will be a form of insurance in any regard. If I screw things up with that, as it's been a while since I've airbrushed anything, I can always snap the Stewart shell back on.
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Post by riggelweg on May 20, 2012 9:07:57 GMT -8
I think what I meant to say was that Athearn did not change the original Highliner shell molds. The Athearn frame may have changed but we are talking about the Stewart shell. You CAN use the Stewart porthole window clip to mount the shell without gluing it in place. I know because mine are not glued in and the highliner shell sits securely to the Stewart frame fine. Very interesting. Thanks BTW, nice PC unit. I love the weathering you did with the windshields. |
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Post by riogrande on May 20, 2012 9:32:13 GMT -8
Thanks for your very detailed reply. The picture is hosted on Photobucket. It's also blocked at my place of employment. The Stewart shell does have mold lines on the nose, and I do agree that the grills look pretty good. I don't have too many complaints about the shell. I suppose that if I am to go to the trouble of sanding off the mold lines, I might as just start over with a Highliner shell. It will be a form of insurance in any regard. If I screw things up with that, as it's been a while since I've airbrushed anything, I can always snap the Stewart shell back on. Here a photo of my Genesis F9m later one when I get home (one of the cool things Athearn Genesis was able to offer as a result of the Highliner shell options, it's a combination of F9 and F3 details and prototypically matches a Rio Grande rebuilt "F9m". The roof is all F3 squirrel cage db fan and tall cooling fans, side details are all F9 with split vertical louvers and Farr air grills. D&RGW F9A 5531 was wrecked in 1953 and rebuit by EMD. Genesis has offered this interesting diesel in the 50's 4-stripe and 60's single stripe versions.  As far as the Highliner shell vs the Stewart, I'll have to look at the etched metal grills. Depending on the phase of F3, the Stewart F3 holds up quite well. The etched metal details are less critical on the F3's. Some people have shadow masked the chicken wire areas and dang if they don't look nearly as good as the Genesis F3. To be fair, the Genesis F3's have a fine chicken wire part inserted in the side panels and is superior, but the Stewarts molded checken wire looks pretty good disguised if masked and painted. The biggest improvement of the Genesis is the nose, which most say the nose gets the compound curves of the EMD F unit the closest out of any HO model. The Stewart is quite good though so is a worthy model if you sand the mold lines on the nose, add details and shadow mask the grill areas. I need to go hunt down some articles which show some of the fine examples folks like Jim Six did with Stewart F units, you'll be quite please at the results if you see the photo's. I'm actually still a big fan of Stewart F units and believe for painters and detailers, they are a good option even today. For folks wanting a nice F unit, out of the box RTR fashion, Genesis is hard to beat - although most of the earlier Genesis F units need dressing up still to represent the "modernized" versions. I only have a couple of "modernized" Genesis like the D&RGW F7A #5764 and WP FP7A, that has all the nose trimmings for latter day D&RGW - I really need to get another F7A and re-number it to 5761 to complete the F7A/F9B/F9B/F7A set! |
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Post by riggelweg on May 20, 2012 14:21:25 GMT -8
That's a cool looking model. Thanks again for another detailed post.
Now, to throw a monkey wrench in things, I found two Stewart F7s at the LHS yesterday for a killer price. Maybe I should snap those up and also retrofit with Highliner shells...
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Post by calzephyr on May 20, 2012 14:48:39 GMT -8
That's a cool looking model. Thanks again for another detailed post. Now, to throw a monkey wrench in things, I found two Stewart F7s at the LHS yesterday for a killer price. Maybe I should snap those up and also retrofit with Highliner shells... If it were me, I would purchase those for the drives. Larry |
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Post by calzephyr on May 20, 2012 14:54:18 GMT -8
Thanks for your very detailed reply. The picture is hosted on Photobucket. It's also blocked at my place of employment. The Stewart shell does have mold lines on the nose, and I do agree that the grills look pretty good. I don't have too many complaints about the shell. I suppose that if I am to go to the trouble of sanding off the mold lines, I might as just start over with a Highliner shell. It will be a form of insurance in any regard. If I screw things up with that, as it's been a while since I've airbrushed anything, I can always snap the Stewart shell back on. Here a photo of my Genesis F9m later one when I get home (one of the cool things Athearn Genesis was able to offer as a result of the Highliner shell options, it's a combination of F9 and F3 details and prototypically matches a Rio Grande rebuilt "F9m". The roof is all F3 squirrel cage db fan and tall cooling fans, side details are all F9 with split vertical louvers and Farr air grills. D&RGW F9A 5531 was wrecked in 1953 and rebuit by EMD. Genesis has offered this interesting diesel in the 50's 4-stripe and 60's single stripe versions. As far as the Highliner shell vs the Stewart, I'll have to look at the etched metal grills. Depending on the phase of F3, the Stewart F3 holds up quite well. The etched metal details are less critical on the F3's. Some people have shadow masked the chicken wire areas and dang if they don't look nearly as good as the Genesis F3. To be fair, the Genesis F3's have a fine chicken wire part inserted in the side panels and is superior, but the Stewarts molded checken wire looks pretty good disguised if masked and painted. The biggest improvement of the Genesis is the nose, which most say the nose gets the compound curves of the EMD F unit the closest out of any HO model. The Stewart is quite good though so is a worthy model if you sand the mold lines on the nose, add details and shadow mask the grill areas. I need to go hunt down some articles which show some of the fine examples folks like Jim Six did with Stewart F units, you'll be quite please at the results if you see the photo's. I'm actually still a big fan of Stewart F units and believe for painters and detailers, they are a good option even today. For folks wanting a nice F unit, out of the box RTR fashion, Genesis is hard to beat - although most of the earlier Genesis F units need dressing up still to represent the "modernized" versions. I only have a couple of "modernized" Genesis like the D&RGW F7A #5764 and WP FP7A, that has all the nose trimmings for latter day D&RGW - I really need to get another F7A and re-number it to 5761 to complete the F7A/F9B/F9B/F7A set! Nice model for sure. Wrecks used to make for some interesting rebuilt models and this is one for sure. Nice to see the fans and DB being the F3 and the sides representing the F9 units. Some trade in units to the EMD in the fities were rebuilt and received less than 100% modifications resulting in the example of the Santa Fe E8M units. Larry |
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Post by riogrande on May 20, 2012 14:59:29 GMT -8
That's a cool looking model. Thanks again for another detailed post. Now, to throw a monkey wrench in things, I found two Stewart F7s at the LHS yesterday for a killer price. Maybe I should snap those up and also retrofit with Highliner shells... If it were me, I would purchase those for the drives. Larry Yes, or price the drives alone and see if it is worth the price. Check fleabay for Stewart F drives to see what they go for. But if the prices are around $40-50 for the loco, I imagine that is the range the bare Stewart drive would sell for on ebay? Nice model for sure. Wrecks used to make for some interesting rebuilt models and this is one for sure. Nice to see the fans and DB being the F3 and the sides representing the F9 units. Some trade in units to the EMD in the fities were rebuilt and received less than 100% modifications resulting in the example of the Santa Fe E8M units. Larry The Rio Grande had at least 3 F units which were wrecked and rebuilt: An FT A unit was rebuilt and looked like and F7A (early phase) when sent back, but apparently was still mechanically an FT The afore mentioned F3A in the photo. And 3rdly, an F7A was rebuilt also into an F9m in appearance #5571, but the roof was F7 rather than F3. In my Rio Grande books there are photo's of the Santa Fe E8m's which apparently ran on the Joint Line between Denver and Pueblo and south. |
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Post by riggelweg on May 20, 2012 15:31:47 GMT -8
That's a cool looking model. Thanks again for another detailed post. Now, to throw a monkey wrench in things, I found two Stewart F7s at the LHS yesterday for a killer price. Maybe I should snap those up and also retrofit with Highliner shells... If it were me, I would purchase those for the drives. Larry I think I might have to. ;D Yes, or price the drives alone and see if it is worth the price. Check fleabay for Stewart F drives to see what they go for. But if the prices are around $40-50 for the loco, I imagine that is the range the bare Stewart drive would sell for on ebay? These F7s are for $50 each. Considering the F3s I purchased in the mid 1990s cost $75 each, I think this is a steal. |
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Post by riggelweg on May 20, 2012 15:57:04 GMT -8
As far as the Highliner shell vs the Stewart, I'll have to look at the etched metal grills. Depending on the phase of F3, the Stewart F3 holds up quite well. The etched metal details are less critical on the F3's. Some people have shadow masked the chicken wire areas and dang if they don't look nearly as good as the Genesis F3. To be fair, the Genesis F3's have a fine chicken wire part inserted in the side panels and is superior, but the Stewarts molded checken wire looks pretty good disguised if masked and painted. The Stewart F3 I have has the Farr-Air Phase 4 grilles. Reading F3s were very late phase F3s. They differ from the early phase F7s in that they don't have a dynamic brake fan, only a blower. The grilles on your Highliner shell do look a lot nicer. |
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Post by riogrande on May 20, 2012 18:26:36 GMT -8
If you are throwing away the shell, it is not really a steal. I just did a quick Ebay search and found two Stewart chassis for around $55 each give or take, so your basically getting the same thing for a little less. My guess is if you watch Ebay, you'll find Stewart chassis for $50, and if you get lucky less. Anyhow, it's not a lousy deal, but not a steal unless you plan on using the shell too or selling the shell for a few bucks. Read more: atlasrescueforum.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=hoforum&thread=145&page=1#ixzz1vT24iyaNThe Stewart F3 I have has the Far-Air grilles. Reading F3s were very late phase F3s. They differ from the early phase F7s in that they don't have a dynamic brake fan, only a blower. The grilles on your Highliner shell do look a lot nicer. I didn't think any of the Stewarts had the F9A style Farr air grills. I recall Stewart did four phases of F3's. Phase I - high fans, upper chicken wire air grills, and 3 window portals. Phase II - high fans, upper chicken wire air grills, side vents with chicken wire in-between. Phase III - high fans, F7 side louvers and chicken wire upper grills (from memory - couldn't find a photo) Phase IV - basically F7 details with a F3 db fan (upper air grills are the early F7 style, not Farr. I don't think any Stewart F3's had Farr air grills, only the phase II F7 and F9. |
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Post by riggelweg on May 20, 2012 18:53:33 GMT -8
Well, you might have talked some sanity into me regarding the F7s. They are already painted for the Reading, and the paint looked good, so it might be stupid to replace the shells. Athearn did have a Genesis Reading F7 a few years ago, but they are very hard to find. Maybe I should wait until I can find a pair.
Also, thanks for your summary of the phases of the F3. Are you saying that the horizontal grille is not Far-Air, only the vertical grille on the F7, phase 2? My reference, Reading Diesels Volume 1, refers to the grille on the phase 4 F3 and the phase 1 F7 as "Far-Air." Is that incorrect?
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Post by riogrande on May 20, 2012 19:09:14 GMT -8
Books have mistakes in them all the time. But I got the name Farr air grills from my Rio Grande Diesels Volume 1, by Joseph Strapac, but that book may have errors too.
I'll see if I can look up the reference and may be find something on Details West or Details Associates because they sell the Farr air etched metal grills - I think I still have a set I was going to use to convert an old Athearn bb F7 into and F9 many moons ago.
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Post by riggelweg on May 20, 2012 19:21:16 GMT -8
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Post by riogrande on May 20, 2012 19:33:42 GMT -8
No worries, I'm wrong more often than I'm right - just ask my wife!
The early F7 air grills don't seem to have a special name. BTW, the Farr air grills were also used on the flarred SP radiators too, depending on the year/model.
I have found a number of errors in my Joseph Strapac books Rio Grande Diesels Vols 1, 2 and 3. I've noticed diesels mislabled in consists in the captions too.
Anywho, I found it interesting the reference comments from Model Railroader about the late phase F7's having Farr air grills, and the roof hang eliminated. Stewart followed this combination in their late phase F7. Sadly for Rio Grande fans, my D&RGW late phase F7's have no roof over hand, but wait, the real late phase F7's owned by D&RGW did indeed have roof over hangs and they were delivered in 1952 according to RGD Vol 1 (number series #5701-5764 bar the F9's in that series. The F9's had no roof over hang of course as seen in the Rio Grande Zephyr F9's. Ah, details details.
Regarding phase details, I've read that those are terms applied by railfans and never used by EMD or the railroads. And of course, phase details are maybe a generalization, but as with my phase II D&RGW F7's, there are often exceptions to the description!
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Post by riggelweg on May 21, 2012 4:07:59 GMT -8
No worries, I'm wrong more often than I'm right - just ask my wife! The early F7 air grills don't seem to have a special name. BTW, the Farr air grills were also used on the flarred SP radiators too, depending on the year/model. I have found a number of errors in my Joseph Strapac books Rio Grande Diesels Vols 1, 2 and 3. I've noticed diesels mislabled in consists in the captions too. Anywho, I found it interesting the reference comments from Model Railroader about the late phase F7's having Farr air grills, and the roof hang eliminated. Stewart followed this combination in their late phase F7. Sadly for Rio Grande fans, my D&RGW late phase F7's have no roof over hand, but wait, the real late phase F7's owned by D&RGW did indeed have roof over hangs and they were delivered in 1952 according to RGD Vol 1 (number series #5701-5764 bar the F9's in that series. The F9's had no roof over hang of course as seen in the Rio Grande Zephyr F9's. Ah, details details. Regarding phase details, I've read that those are terms applied by railfans and never used by EMD or the railroads. And of course, phase details are maybe a generalization, but as with my phase II D&RGW F7's, there are often exceptions to the description! I hear you! I've only been married a year, and I've already learned to say, "Yes, ma'am." That's interesting about the late-phase II D&RGW F7s having roof overhangs. It just goes to show that you really have to have a photograph of the specific road number to verify what it did (or does) have or not have. I have seen this with repainted Reading units. It's amazing how certain units would be repainted, and none would follow the exact same scheme. Some would have yellow sills, some not. I have heard that the phases were made up by modelers. Modelers can be exacting and can be obsessed with organization (forget the workbench!). Thus, they invented phases so that locomotives could be grouped and categorized. It makes sense, though, that phases are not always accurate. Railroads had all sorts of preferences, which made their way into customized features on locomotives. |
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2012 8:32:30 GMT -8
Thanks for your very detailed reply. The picture is hosted on Photobucket. It's also blocked at my place of employment. The Stewart shell does have mold lines on the nose, and I do agree that the grills look pretty good. I don't have too many complaints about the shell. I suppose that if I am to go to the trouble of sanding off the mold lines, I might as just start over with a Highliner shell. It will be a form of insurance in any regard. If I screw things up with that, as it's been a while since I've airbrushed anything, I can always snap the Stewart shell back on. Here a photo of my Genesis F9m later one when I get home (one of the cool things Athearn Genesis was able to offer as a result of the Highliner shell options, it's a combination of F9 and F3 details and prototypically matches a Rio Grande rebuilt "F9m". The roof is all F3 squirrel cage db fan and tall cooling fans, side details are all F9 with split vertical louvers and Farr air grills. D&RGW F9A 5531 was wrecked in 1953 and rebuit by EMD. Genesis has offered this interesting diesel in the 50's 4-stripe and 60's single stripe versions. As far as the Highliner shell vs the Stewart, I'll have to look at the etched metal grills. Depending on the phase of F3, the Stewart F3 holds up quite well. The etched metal details are less critical on the F3's. Some people have shadow masked the chicken wire areas and dang if they don't look nearly as good as the Genesis F3. To be fair, the Genesis F3's have a fine chicken wire part inserted in the side panels and is superior, but the Stewarts molded checken wire looks pretty good disguised if masked and painted. The biggest improvement of the Genesis is the nose, which most say the nose gets the compound curves of the EMD F unit the closest out of any HO model. The Stewart is quite good though so is a worthy model if you sand the mold lines on the nose, add details and shadow mask the grill areas. I need to go hunt down some articles which show some of the fine examples folks like Jim Six did with Stewart F units, you'll be quite please at the results if you see the photo's. I'm actually still a big fan of Stewart F units and believe for painters and detailers, they are a good option even today. For folks wanting a nice F unit, out of the box RTR fashion, Genesis is hard to beat - although most of the earlier Genesis F units need dressing up still to represent the "modernized" versions. I only have a couple of "modernized" Genesis like the D&RGW F7A #5764 and WP FP7A, that has all the nose trimmings for latter day D&RGW - I really need to get another F7A and re-number it to 5761 to complete the F7A/F9B/F9B/F7A set! A Stewart shell that I'm doing as Great Northern 315A-B-C. This photo is of the shells unpainted  This is a photo of the shell painted and in stripes...This GN paint scheme is a confidence builder!   A Highliner shell sitting on a Genesis drive that I added Tsunami sound and lighting effects.  |
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Post by rhpd42002 on May 21, 2012 16:08:52 GMT -8
Jim, that is some EXCELLENT paint on the GN unit. You are absolutely correct in saying that doing that paint scheme, well, is a confidence builder. Not something I'm even close to being ready to try!! I hope you'll post the trio when you're done.  |
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Post by riogrande on May 22, 2012 13:51:32 GMT -8
I imagine the thin stripes aren't easy to do sharp and even. Looks great!
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