E L railroad

[bcrn]

does anyone know what the el had to go through to prep the pa's and e units for freight service?

[The Ferro Kid]

Feb 27, 2016 19:49:53 GMT -8 bcrn said:

does anyone know what the el had to go through to prep the pa's and e units for freight service?

According to one source, the EL removed the steam generators, regeared, weighted, and re-wheeled the E8s (with some exceptions) for freight service. See (and page way down):

www.rr-fallenflags.org/el/loco/e8.html

Probably much the same changes were made to the PAs. Of course, the PAs (all former Erie units) were older, really worn, and were gone from the EL by the mid-60s.

[Spikre]

EL PAs lasted into 69,then went in Trade on SDP45s or U33Cs.
2 PA-2s kept their S-Gs until the end,they were Protection
Power from Marion to Chicago for the Lake Cities,the Cleveland
Commuter,and Executive trains.
not much was done to the PAs except to replace the Weight lost
from removing the S-Gs.
the GE 752 Traction motors were fine pulling freight.
note that EL was about the 2nd to last Original PA Operator,seems
maybe SP ran several longer.
not including the 2nd hand D&H PAs here.
both EL and D&H were in Dereco by the time the EL units were gone.
the E8s were a different story as they were still used on the
Cleveland Train and the Port Jervis trains until NJDOT worked
out a deal with Metro North ?
so about half the E8s left got the Full rebuild,extra weight,38"
wheels,lower gearing,and S-Gs removed.
the rest kept the passenger gearing and S-Gs,and could work the
Cleveland,Port Jervis and Executine Trains.
the Executive trains became rather common during 74/75/76.
a few E units were retired and their engines rebuilt for the RS-3M
re-engining program that started in 75.
only 1 was completed before CR day.USRA cancelled the U23Bs and GP38-2s,
so EL decided to rebuild the RS-3 Fleet,but didn't get too far by CR day.
Spikre

[bcrn]

i remember reading about this in a magazine at some point in the past, and your thread on el fa's got the wheels turning, so i had to ask. i thought it was kinda extensive. i wasnt aware the wheels were that much smaller though.

[Spikre]

bcrm,
AFAIK all postwar E units were built with 36" wheels.
it could be that all were,but I'm not sure about that.
EL changed some of the Freight Es to 38" wheels to combat
slipping and fishtailing when in MU with regular freight
units like SD45s and SDP45s.
Spikre

[Great-Northern-Willmar Div]

All the Erie Lackamoney E8's had an extra sand box and fill added. When EL replaced the original EMD side sheeting of E8's with plate steel, the first panel behind the cab received a sand fill for the extra sand box. EL E8's also lost their porthole windows with the conversion to sheet steel sides.

Now, I don't know about EL removing the steam generators in the E8's. Looking through the photos of the units in the 1970's, all still had their steam generator exhaust, blow down pipes and air intake vent. In the E8 the steam generator supplies a nice lump of ballast on the back of the unit. I also see in photos where the E8's still have both the water and fuel fillers. The tanks on these units were still the same as in passenger service with two water tanks on the outside of the unit and the fuel tank in the middle between the frame rails. It is easy to tell a fuel fill from a water fill. To make the water tanks into fuel tanks would require dropping the tank and removing the baffles between the three tanks. The water fill would be removed and it stayed on the units that were in freight service indicating, EL did not alter the fuel/water tanks.

I can see the steam generators being deactivated in the E8's but remaining as ballast. Many other railroads of the 1970's did just that on their former passenger units. Plus since Erie Lackawanna was lacking money why waste money on all the effort of removing the boilers, dropping in a slab of concrete AND doing major surgery on the fuel/water tanks. Leave the steam generator in place cut the water and fuel lines and fill the water tanks with water to act as more ballast.

[Spikre]

Jim,
it has been reported that the Full EL rebuild added some sort
of Ballast to the E8s to reduce slipping, look for units re-classed
as FE-22.
the non rebuilt Es kept Class PE-22.
You may be finding lots of pics of the PE-22s.
also the rebuilds were after 73 or so, check picture dates.
would watch 4 units on Collin's Curve - the Waldwick S Curve made famous
by Bob Collin's pictures.Wycoff Ave bridge was a great spot to watch 4
Es going west about 10 MPH with the units fish tailing back and forth,
the Saturday Westbound Cleanup train was always a bit too much for either
group of Es,Bob Collins even said so.
later EL switched to C424/425 power on that train and they wouldn't bust 15 MPH
with a regular train,but they didn't slide and fishtail climbing the grade.
Spikre

[roadkill]

Come on, Spikre, you know the best place to watch EL E's was right here in Ohio . Wish like heck I was around to watch 4 unit consists of E's rip through the western Ohio and Indiana countrysides.

[jaygee]

Yer all wrong ! Best place to watch EL E8s was in Summit cut...with a heavy westbound Phoebe or Lake Cities consist ......Huzzah !

[Spikre]

Mr Jim,
have recalled that some one at an EL Meet said that the FE-22s
had Cement poured into the worn out Steam genorators.
whether that is correct or not,dont know,but it would save the trouble
of removing the S-G units.
the PE-22s kept their S-Gs up until CR day,as they could be used in Cleveland
service,or on Inspection trains.
jaygee,
Collin's Curve in Waldwick/Ho-Ho-Kus was the best spot in the NY/NJ Metro
area to watch trains,but the lack of freights was severe after 71.
Spikre

[jaygee]

You'll notice I said E8s.....not EL trains in general.

[Spikre]

jaygee,
that didn't work too well after the Lake Cities was DQed
in early January 1970.
but moving the Freights over to Lackawanna side really
put a dent in train watching after the PJ Trains went to
GEs and Comet cars.
was nice when they had Detours,but not for the Bottom Line.
Spikre

[jaygee]

I left North Jersey for DC in June '71, so I missed out on all the pre Conrail mayhem. After Jan. 1970, us M&E folks had to go far and wide. But nobody ever did E8 like DL&W / EL !