How common were 60' boxcars?

[packer]

I'm in slow process of selling off my relatively large amount of lower end rolling stock for smaller amount of higher end rolling stock. I do want to focus on the more common car types (as much as I like
Rapido and I like the flexi-flo i'm passing on it because I'd doubt it'd
be on BN rails). I saw exactrail's sale of the month and am wondering how common 60' cars were.

I've been searching youtube for videos, and have found BN in the early 70s to see common car types, but not much in the way of 1978-82 videos. Any other resources I could use for this?

[riogrande]

I'd guess 60' box cars were pretty common during the 78-82 period and it does depend on the traffic. I am interested in the same period and many of the 60' box cars were auto parts or beer/wine carriers. Of course BN rostered a number of the PC&F 61' beer RBL box cars which both Eel River has made (1977 production) and ExactRail (1980 production version). Both are sold-out except ER does have the RBCS (Colorado & Souther) BN logo version. The others would be a treasure hunt.

Those ExactRail box cars on sale are auto parts box cars which were common on auto parts routes. D&RGW participated in the Ford FAST service which alternated every 90 days back and forth between Rio Grande and UP, other connections alternated too which was a condition of the contract to promote competition and performance. I have picked up a number of the ER 60' Greenville and P-S 7315 waffle for a mix of cars seen in D&RGW freights and Ford FAST consists.

Again, it depends on the traffic over your route to some degree.

[packer]

Oct 17, 2018 3:32:23 GMT -8 riogrande said:

I'd guess 60' box cars were pretty common during the 78-82 period and it does depend on the traffic. I am interested in the same period and many of the 60' box cars were auto parts or beer/wine carriers. Of course BN rostered a number of the PC&F 61' beer RBL box cars which both Eel River has made (1977 production) and ExactRail (1980 production version). Both are sold-out except ER does have the RBCS (Colorado & Souther) BN logo version. The others would be a treasure hunt.

I have a few of the Eel River cars in BN. According to the research I've done, the numbers Exactrail chose for the RBCS cars are wrong for their car. I do have a factory weathered MP exactrail car (never knew they did that). I suppose it wouldn't be to hard to change the numbers around or make the RBCS cars BN cars, but I'd wait for a sale before jumping on that.

Those ExactRail box cars on sale are auto parts box cars which were common on auto parts routes. D&RGW participated in the Ford FAST service which alternated every 90 days back and forth between Rio Grande and UP, other connections alternated too which was a condition of the contract to promote competition and performance. I have picked up a number of the ER 60' Greenville and P-S 7315 waffle for a mix of cars seen in D&RGW freights and Ford FAST consists.

Again, it depends on the traffic over your route to some degree.

Well I had ordered an NW and MILW of the cars Exactrail has on sale (also got an NP flat). I have a couple of the Intermountain PS-1 (ATSF x2) and Athearn FMC (MP and L&N) cars, a few Genesis PS-1s (2 BN and 1 CBQ), and a 60' Southern PS Waffle car I picked up at the last show was. I'm just wondering if I should really have that many as most were bought during the time I was picking up whatever was a good car cheap even if it meant fixing up.

I don't have a particular route in mind, and sometimes motive power was confined to a specific area. I have ALCOs which usually stayed in the pacific northwest (however they did venture south on WP trains, but were all gone by 1980), but then I have GP15-1s which seem to have stayed on the old SLSF lines (which wouldn't appear before 1980).

[dti406]

Also, besides Auto Parts, a lot of 60' Boxcars ended up in Appliance Service mainly the high cube cars with 10' sliding doors, the Western Maryland cars were used to haul paper products.

To expannd on Jim's post the Exactrail 60' cars were mainly in Ford Service as Ford preferred cars with 2 - 8' Plug Doors on each side.

GM & Chrysler preferred cars with either 1-10' Slider or 2 - 8' Sliders. These were mostly represented by the 60' Pullman Standard car from either Intermountain or Walthers, or the ACF cars from Atlas.

The Great Northern had some of the Early 60' Double Plug Doors but not the Exactrail cars, the Con-Cor (Ex Robbins Rails or A-Line) is closer but the doors would have to be scratchbuilt to match the prototype. The GN also had some of the Pullman Standard 60' Cars also called Fisher Body Cars) that were assigned to a GM plant but they were quickly pulled out of that service and were put into carrying copper anodes if I remember correctly.

Rick Jesionowski

[riogrande]

Oct 17, 2018 8:18:52 GMT -8 packer said:

I have a few of the Eel River cars in BN. According to the research I've done, the numbers Exactrail chose for the RBCS cars are wrong for their car. I do have a factory weathered MP exactrail car (never knew they did that). I suppose it wouldn't be to hard to change the numbers around or make the RBCS cars BN cars, but I'd wait for a sale before jumping on that.

Yeah, my research about the RBCS PC&F yielded the same thing, wrong numbers. I did mention it to Blaine and the it was claimed the numbers were correct. I guess I'm not the only one who couldn't reconcile the road numbers. I bought a single anyway.

Well I had ordered an NW and MILW of the cars Exactrail has on sale (also got an NP flat). I have a couple of the Intermountain PS-1 (ATSF x2) and Athearn FMC (MP and L&N) cars, a few Genesis PS-1s (2 BN and 1 CBQ), and a 60' Southern PS Waffle car I picked up at the last show was. I'm just wondering if I should really have that many as most were bought during the time I was picking up whatever was a good car cheap even if it meant fixing up.

I don't have a particular route in mind, and sometimes motive power was confined to a specific area. I have ALCOs which usually stayed in the pacific northwest (however they did venture south on WP trains, but were all gone by 1980), but then I have GP15-1s which seem to have stayed on the old SLSF lines (which wouldn't appear before 1980).

The NP GSC flat car? Those are nice; I got one of each NP version, and one each of the brown and yellow UP versions. For MILW, so far I have the Athearn Berwick MILW but not the P-S yet. Speaking of Athearn, the Berwicks were also 60' waffle cars in auto parts traffic. I have a number of them as well. The Southern Berwick has a 3-panel stencil that I am going to have to decal over to change to a 2 panel correct for my era. I'm not sure how many are too many.

[riogrande]

Good feedback Rick. Yes, per a great article in one of my magazines Ford used single door and GM double.

I forgot about the Atlas ACF 60 footer I had a long time now. They didn't seem common on the FF from photos so not sure if they followed the same auto parts pools. I do have a Robin's Rails 60' Grand Trunk also.

[Deleted]

I live in the Harrisburg, PA area near Enola Yard. Even up into recent years we saw lots of 60' and 86' autoparts boxcars in long cuts if not complete trains. Conrail even purchased hundreds of them secondhand from Santa Fe. If you are not along autoparts corridors then maybe you don't see them, but there still are solid trains.

Models can be hit or miss: Exactrail has the correct Western Pacific Greenville 60' hi cube, while Genesis offered the same car as the incorrect waffle side version, thus a foobie. Photoverified Genesis foobie.

On the other hand, right now, there's Athearn Roundhouse 60' hi cubes out there with separately applied metal grabs, nice stirrup steps, and minimal extra details that are actually photoverified correct for Western Pacific 60' exterior post hi cube sliding door cars. According to what I've been able to read, even though they look like appliance service cars, some were used for autoparts service.

The Charles Smiley dvd "Western Pacific's Last Decade" (1973-83) shows lots of autoparts traffic to the Ford plant at Milpitas, CA. The "San Jose Turn" was often powered by the famous "final 4" F units.

Today most of the hi cube boxcars still out there are owned by eastern roads.

[riogrande]

Nov 21, 2018 5:47:46 GMT -8 @texasandpacific said:

Models can be hit or miss: Exactrail has the correct Western Pacific Greenville 60' hi cube, while Genesis offered the same car as the incorrect waffle side version, thus a foobie. Photoverified Genesis foobie.

Which Genesis WP 60' foot is a foobie?

There was/is a Genesis Berwick waffle 60' WP. Railcarphotos lists a Berwick 60' waffle built in 1979. Is it not a match?


www.railcarphotos.com/PhotoDetails.php?PhotoID=9295

On the other hand, right now, there's Athearn Roundhouse 60' hi cubes out there with separately applied metal grabs, nice stirrup steps, and minimal extra details that are actually photoverified correct for Western Pacific 60' exterior post hi cube sliding door cars. According to what I've been able to read, even though they look like appliance service cars, some were used for autoparts service.

I'm looking on Athearns site and am not finding any 60' Roundhouse boxcars. Link?

The Charles Smiley dvd "Western Pacific's Last Decade" (1973-83) shows lots of autoparts traffic to the Ford plant at Milpitas, CA.

I need to get that DVD, should be good. Some of those trains were handed off to the Rio Grande.

[Deleted]

OK, looks like I got number series mixed up. My apologies to all. The 3768 to 3775 cars are waffle-sided Berwick Forge and Fabricating cars. The Exactrail car is 3761 to 3767 series, Pool 322 assigned to Lima, OH.

Athearn 72648 to 72650 are WP FMC 60' EP sliding single door boxcars. One source I read said some were used for autoparts service. The ones I just got are actually in "Roundhouse" labeled boxes!

[riogrande]

Interestingly, some of the WP PC&F 60' box cars appeared to be re-numbered and the notes from RailCarPhotos are as follows (from the RCP site):

"WP series 3171-3178; from WP series 3151-3167 built by Pacific Car & Foundry, Lot ____, Apr-75 with cushioned underframe, pneumatic bulkheads, and air bags for GE appliance service."

Here is a photo from that series:

www.railcarphotos.com/PhotoDetails.php?PhotoID=23013


Based on the number series on Athearn's Western Pacific FMC 60' box car is a foobie.


www.athearn.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=ATH72650

Two visible key differences between the Athearn FMC 60' box car and the Prototype PC&F box car are the side sills and he ends. The model has stepped in side sills and the ends are non-terminating type vs. the prototypes
full length side sills and dreadnaught ends.

[Deleted]

I can't see the image you provided because I'm not a member of the site but I see your point on the ends and sill.  Side arrangement appears same, but the sill appears different.

[riogrande]

Unfortunately there weren't any photo's of the number series built by PC&F 3151-3167 or 3171-3178 on rr-fallenflags.org so I couldn't post a link there.

It's easy to create an account for railcarphoto's and doesn't cost anything. The photo I linked has a good view including the end of the box car and it's a "washboard" or dreadnaught style end typical of box cars built in the 1970's and earlier. The FMC model by Athearn, which has sides similar to the PC&F, has non-terminating ends, which began superseding the dread-naught type during the 1970's and later.


I found a roof shot of the PC&F on railcarphoto's and it has totally different roof than the FMC 60'. The PC&F has a horizontal rib roof with a prominant ribs adjacent to the side ribs, a bit like the pattern on the PC&F reefers.

www.railcarphotos.com/PhotoDetails.php?PhotoID=62790

The FMC 60' box car had a x-pattern of ribs on the roof by way of contrast.


So in summary, visible differences between the Athearn model and the closest WP 60' exterior post box car: 1) different roof, 2) different bottom side sill pattern and 3) different ends.

[Deleted]

Yes sir, got it. Thank you for the correction.

I use rrpicturearchives.net

There (now) appear to be several photos of these cars there.

[riogrande]

Found them on rrpicturesarchive.net also. The site is kind of sluggish and laggy.

Here is a good photo with both roof and ends visible

rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3131354