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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 12, 2020 6:37:26 GMT -8
I would disqualify the NP schemes because each uses three colors of paint. For me, the rule is a maximum of two colors of paint, plus one other color for lettering. I'll let that little patch of white on the E-L scheme through, though. Gorgeous!
CN, too. Black, red and white.
If you let CN/NP in, then UP can come in. And pretty soon, everyone's in.
Nope.
And. Don't forget. We're after the BEST. If you're talking about the Big Letters on Blue B&O/C&O scheme, I surely wouldn't call it the best.
Ed
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Post by thebessemerkid on Apr 12, 2020 6:57:22 GMT -8
I would disqualify the NP schemes because each uses three colors of paint. For me, the rule is a maximum of two colors of paint, plus one other color for lettering. I'll let that little patch of white on the E-L scheme through, though. Gorgeous! CN, too. Black, red and white. If you let CN/NP in, then UP can come in. And pretty soon, everyone's in. Nope. And. Don't forget. We're after the BEST. If you're talking about the Big Letters on Blue B&O/C&O scheme, I surely wouldn't call it the best. Ed NP black & yellow?     |
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Post by thebessemerkid on Apr 12, 2020 7:07:13 GMT -8
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Post by thebessemerkid on Apr 12, 2020 7:16:21 GMT -8
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 12, 2020 9:03:31 GMT -8
Black, yellow and red. from NPRHA drift card comments: "Red--Referred to as "Red" on NP diesel paint diagrams.........used for diesel locomotive stripes..." I'll let your CN Alco go, even though that white sill stripe is kind of a third color--that scheme IS excellent. On an Alco. I had a Tyco C-430 in CN. The C&O and B&O samples are different than the ones I had in mind, but they still don't do much for me. Of the others, the LA&L is pretty darn decent. And I DO like the Conrail ghosts (don't really like Conrail blue all that much--don't know why). Of course, the locos themselves are pretty cool looking. I've got one of the B-trucked versions to paint up in BN. Someday. I got to thinking maybe I just have a problem with blue on diesels. So I searched for "blue diesel locomotive". Found this: trpmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/trp-nkp-diesels-02.jpg(For some reason, I'm not able to place photos here--don't know why.) That has to be about the flashiest non-flashy scheme I've seen. Only two colors, INCLUDING the lettering. Of course, the basic locos help a lot. Ed |
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Post by thebessemerkid on Apr 12, 2020 19:19:13 GMT -8
Black, yellow and red. from NPRHA drift card comments: "Red--Referred to as "Red" on NP diesel paint diagrams.........used for diesel locomotive stripes..." I'll let your CN Alco go, even though that white sill stripe is kind of a third color--that scheme IS excellent. On an Alco. I had a Tyco C-430 in CN. The C&O and B&O samples are different than the ones I had in mind, but they still don't do much for me. Of the others, the LA&L is pretty darn decent. And I DO like the Conrail ghosts (don't really like Conrail blue all that much--don't know why). Of course, the locos themselves are pretty cool looking. I've got one of the B-trucked versions to paint up in BN. Someday. I got to thinking maybe I just have a problem with blue on diesels. So I searched for "blue diesel locomotive". Found this: trpmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/trp-nkp-diesels-02.jpg(For some reason, I'm not able to place photos here--don't know why.) That has to be about the flashiest non-flashy scheme I've seen. Only two colors, INCLUDING the lettering. Of course, the basic locos help a lot. Ed The NKP PA's were knockouts. I sorta (knowingly  missed the red in the NP scheme, because it's so darn good looking. If I were Warren Buffet I would order ALL locos repainted in that scheme. Well, and a bunch of heritage units. Heck, if I were WB I would order cabooses be reinstated. Unmanned, since I'm a realist, just big rolling boxes for FRED detectors. I'd also put robot brakemen in them to wave at kids. I wouldn't make as much money, but at least I'd show some humanity. I'd also rebuild all the old towers and rent them out as BnB's free to knowledgeable railfans. To qualify, one would have to correctly identify GP30 phases. |
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 13, 2020 8:54:53 GMT -8
AB-SO-LOOTLY!
I DO like that the BNSF covered hoppers got old heralds. But I also think I'd like to see BNSF do some heritage schemes on their locos. I'm not sure whether I'd rather they did the job as if the old railroads had painted the new locos, or the way UP got all artsy. I DO like what UP did. I know, how about one of each? Then we can have arguments about which one looks better! Win-win-win!
Big fun!
Ed
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Post by jason29 on Apr 13, 2020 9:16:02 GMT -8
I've always liked the CN sergeant stripe scheme. I know most would say it is a rather flashy scheme, but really it isn't
Mostly black, so as pointed out doesn't show grime quite as obviously as lighter colours. Although not as large and easy to read as BN numbers, they are still big enough to see from a good distance. The CN noodle isn't all the large and is only displayed on the ends, but let's be honest..who doesn't know the railroad by the scheme. There s no other like it.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 13, 2020 11:20:56 GMT -8
I've always liked the CN sergeant stripe scheme. I know most would say it is a rather flashy scheme, but really it isn't Mostly black, so as pointed out doesn't show grime quite as obviously as lighter colours. Although not as large and easy to read as BN numbers, they are still big enough to see from a good distance. The CN noodle isn't all the large and is only displayed on the ends, but let's be honest..who doesn't know the railroad by the scheme. There s no other like it. Yeah, it does look nice. But. I'm afraid the Rulebook disqualifies this scheme. I'm looking at it right now, and it says: "No more than two colors of paint--lettering can be in a third color--judges MAY accept black trucks and fuel tank--judges MAY accept additional colors in a herald". The paint scheme under consideration uses red, black and white. Thus this CN schemes goes into the "flashy" bin. Along with NP freight. And NP Loewy. And.............. Ed |
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Post by jason29 on Apr 13, 2020 11:36:37 GMT -8
Ok...yeah you got me on a technicality.
How about the old-school Canadian Pacific
maroon and grey?
I'd say any if the red schemes, but even for a scheme that is all one colour, it's a rather bright scheme. I'd call it flashy
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 13, 2020 12:30:28 GMT -8
Ok...yeah you got me on a technicality. How about the old-school Canadian Pacific maroon and grey? Nope. Not a technicality. A rule. Also nope. The classic (and beautiful) CP scheme doesn't count because it uses three colors: grey, maroon, and yellow. There seem to be 387 different versions of the red CP scheme. The ones that have a red "top", black "bottom", and white lettering certainly qualify. They look pretty good, too. Ed |
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Post by mvlandsw on Apr 14, 2020 12:07:35 GMT -8
The B&O, C&O,and N&W solid blue schemes.
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Post by jason29 on Apr 14, 2020 13:10:09 GMT -8
Pacific Great Eastern/early BC Rail two tone green. Pretty bland scheme.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 14, 2020 14:11:40 GMT -8
Pacific Great Eastern/early BC Rail two tone green. Pretty bland scheme. It's the best because it's "bland"? Is that ALL it's got going for it? Ed |
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Post by packer on Apr 15, 2020 18:07:39 GMT -8
Would the Frisco Red/white scheme, SP bloody nose, or IC creamsicle be considered flashy? they're simple but kind of bright colors. The former two are growing on me a bit.
The CNW scheme from the 60-70's and the MP jenks blue scheme are growing on me a bit. CSX stealth is definitely not flashy, but boring. I'm a BN guy though.
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Post by brakie on Apr 15, 2020 18:23:39 GMT -8
The B&O, C&O,and N&W solid blue schemes. I thought those were nifty looking paint schemes far better the C&O's experimental scheme consisting of a black body with white Zebra stripes very similar to Santa Fe's zebra stripe scheme. |
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Post by thebessemerkid on Apr 16, 2020 7:10:30 GMT -8
The Appalachian solid dip job schemes (B&O,C&O,N&W,LV, WM black, RDG solid green, even PC) reflected a no-nonsense utilitarian mindset. All for go, little or nothing for show. Of course most of them got covered with coal dust & grime in short order, so it was as much hiding how filthy most of the locos became. A flashy paint scheme would seem somehow incongruous for coal being hauled out of the hollows during an overcast downpour, old hoppers slowly weaving and clanking by on mud & coal ballasted track. All one expected was a horn echoing through the valleys and finally a dim incandescent light reflecting off the wet rails. Even as recently as last year the Bessemer fielded a fleet of worn-out 40+ year old hoppers banging and clanging and spilling taconite as they passed. The fleet was replaced finally, possibly as an aggravated US Steel was getting irritated that more and more of the load was being spilled along the right of way from Conneaut to the final destination at the remaining furnaces in Pittsburgh. A new fleet of utilitarian end platform hoppers has now replaced all of the old ones. Smooth and silent and kinda soulless. Pulled by all black Illinois Central "death star" SD70's, which one shouldn't complain about. Finding non-widecabs is in itself a rarity these days. Still it doesn't have the same character. Oddly, the once dismal green Union RR MP15's that meet the Bessemer trains are now the colorful ones. Blue and white and the newer red and yellow engines and occasionally the yellow ex-Bessemer caboose ply the rails for the last leg of the trip to the mills. 4 or 5 unit non-turbo 645's working hard on a grade is an auditory treat. Anyway, the western roads with wider open scenery seem somehow better attuned to the flashy schemes. Rolling billboards in otherwise unbroken landscapes. In the east it's rare to find a spot where an entire train can be seen at once, as they duck in and out from behind factories, tunnels, hills and subdivisions. Not much advertising value one might suppose. An SP Daylight for example would just seem wrong here. Even the classic Pennsy 5-stripe was buttoned down and conservative. The now-timeless Erie Lackawanna scheme was perhaps the east's flashiest scheme, but even its colors were understated and business-like. I'd imagine our automobile colors are probably more boring too. We may be more boring! And we wouldn't have it any other way  |
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 16, 2020 7:17:15 GMT -8
Would the Frisco Red/white scheme, SP bloody nose, or IC creamsicle be considered flashy? they're simple but kind of bright colors. The former two are growing on me a bit. The CNW scheme from the 60-70's and the MP jenks blue scheme are growing on me a bit. CSX stealth is definitely not flashy, but boring. I'm a BN guy though. I can see from the discussion since I first started the topic that I hadn't fully thought things out. I started with the idea that the BN "standard" scheme was just about the best of what I called "non-flashy". What I was getting at was that you could make something look really nice if you had the option of fancy graphics and lots colors. Warbonnet looks nice--fancy graphics and lotsa colors. So does the classic Burlington Blackbird scheme. Or even the NP Loewy. If "sky's the limit", it's a lot easier. So I wanted to see if people had suggestions for other schemes that: had relatively simple and straightforward graphics were limited in colors were kinda "pizazzy" might have had actual reasons for the design (as mentioned for BN) Getting to the particular railroads above: Frisco: qualifies, though seems a bit uninspired, what with depending on a big wide stripe IC: looks better to me than the Frisco, but there's a problem with having a white roof on a diesel SP: that is on my original list, I think it's terrific, simple but great color choices, still looks decent when filthy and weathered, as SP so well demonstrated MP: yup, pretty good, a nice color of blue (as compared to Conrail), nicely set of with an eagle and discrete chevrons on the end, numbers could be small and hard to find CNW: sorta OK, nice color choices, a bit uninspired on the placement CSX: yeah, boring, and I still can't accept a railroad ending in "X". Just never gonna happen Ed |
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 16, 2020 7:25:46 GMT -8
The Appalachian solid dip job schemes (B&O,C&O,N&W,LV, WM black, RDG solid green, even PC) reflected a no-nonsense utilitarian mindset. All for go, little or nothing for show. True. The uninspired look may have been connected with those railroads being very close to failing. They LITERALLY had nothing for show. The choice of schemes may well have been based on depression in the board room. But. I'd put PC on my list, based completely on the worms and the lettering font. For a cheap as dirt scheme, I'd say it's one of the best. Ed |
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Post by riogrande on Apr 16, 2020 7:43:12 GMT -8
Interestingly, according to a caption in one of my books, RI was simplifying it's paint on some of it's maroon painted diesels - they had a white stripe on the nose that normally continued all the way to the back, but as a cost cutting measure, started leaving it off. But as we know, RI was financially troubled and yet they began applying the comparatively flashy "bankruptsy blue" paint during the last 4 years. Go figure.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 16, 2020 7:53:47 GMT -8
Hmmmm.
I think The Rock should be on the list!
Ed
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Post by drsvelte on Apr 16, 2020 8:24:46 GMT -8
I’ve always liked the PRR-inspired (mandated) Tuscan scheme that the LV used in the mid-to-late 1960s. Business-like, but with a little flair...  The yellow line curving down on the ends of the RS-11 derivative of PRR practice on EMD cabs....  |
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Post by thebessemerkid on Apr 16, 2020 9:09:16 GMT -8
I’ve always liked the PRR-inspired (mandated) Tuscan scheme that the LV used in the mid-to-late 1960s. Business-like, but with a little flair... The yellow line curving down on the ends of the RS-11 derivative of PRR practice on EMD cabs.... The LV RS-11 was an excellent scheme that Rapido should have captured in their $300 effort, yet somehow fell short. Maybe it was the coarse etched screens, wonky handrails or oversized (plastic?) grabirons, but something looks "off"  |
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 16, 2020 9:31:15 GMT -8
I am DEFINITELY going to have to decide whether or not to order BN and NP RS-11's, when they're announced. I sold my P1K and Atlas back when Rapido could do no wrong. This new one is better than those (wrong dimensions on P1K, fat handrails on Atlas), but.............
Biggest failing I see in the picture is that the stanchions aren't vertical.
Ed
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Post by Colin 't Hart on Apr 16, 2020 11:41:54 GMT -8
For my money the best non-flashy locomotive paint scheme would be the original Burlington Northern scheme.
Runners up, in no particular order:
* Southern Pacific bloody nose
* Rio Grande "switcher" scheme
* Union Pacific's original scheme
* CN noodle (if I'm allowed to go foreign?)
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 16, 2020 12:31:27 GMT -8
Colin,
I'm having trouble pinning down a particular Rio Grande "switcher" scheme. Could you provide a link?
UP's original scheme was yellow and leaf brown, but there was that third color: red (striping). So it's disqualified. And it's still there. Are you perhaps thinking of the black switcher scheme? Not exactly innovative, but I do like it.
Foreign (north and south--we do interchange, after all) is fine. All the CN noodle pictures I'm seeing have three colors, so don't qualify. Again, can you link to an example?
Ed
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Post by jason29 on Apr 16, 2020 15:37:27 GMT -8
Ed, CNs first wet noodle scheme in the 60s was black body, red/orange cab, with the white CN on the long hood.
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Post by edwardsutorik on Apr 16, 2020 16:13:59 GMT -8
Ed, CNs first wet noodle scheme in the 60s was black body, red/orange cab, with the white CN on the long hood. Oh, of course. The scheme that was on my Tyco C-430. Yup, that one passes the judges. AND. It IS a very striking scheme. Ed |
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Post by thunderhawk on Apr 18, 2020 17:38:23 GMT -8
Does the Running Indian on the nose make it flashy? Just two paint colors.  |
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Post by csxt8400 on Apr 19, 2020 14:59:59 GMT -8
I have a bone to pick about what constitutes flashy or not. Anything that takes curved masking and/or intense line shifts seems to go against simplicity. Flashy? Well certainly not simple. I wouldn't consider the Wisconsin Central pine tree scheme (1993+) to be particularly flashy, but it was stunning. The F45s italicized scheme was a bit more in depth but still two primary colors. WC was one of the best schemes of all time, and my disdain for the Santa Fe gives me confidence in saying an SD45 in maroon trumps any style of blue and yellow the ATSF ever applied to the same engine.  Not my photo. |
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missed the red in the NP scheme, because it's so darn good looking. If I were Warren Buffet I would order ALL locos repainted in that scheme. Well, and a bunch of heritage units. Heck, if I were WB I would order cabooses be reinstated. Unmanned, since I'm a realist, just big rolling boxes for FRED detectors. I'd also put robot brakemen in them to wave at kids. I wouldn't make as much money, but at least I'd show some humanity. I'd also rebuild all the old towers and rent them out as BnB's free to knowledgeable railfans. To qualify, one would have to correctly identify GP30 phases.
