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Post by slowfreight on Mar 16, 2022 16:12:57 GMT -8
I picked up my Rapido X72 box cars yesterday. Since the X72 is not a new model to the marketplace, I thought people might appreciate seeing a side-by-side comparison with the other competition in the market...an upgraded Life-Like/P1K/Walthers Mainline X72.        With the supply chain delays and headaches, the dealer margin shrank significantly on these...my street price was $43. Meanwhile, the P1K was upgraded a bit. I carved off the end platforms, molded-on end ladders, and handbrake mechanism. The car was detailed with a Details West cushioned underframe, Moloco Equipco brake kit, leftover Details West end ladders (in PC green, no less!), Kadee couplers, Detail Associates stirrups, Plano crossover platform and cut levers, and a different pair of Walthers 100t trucks. Side ladders are still the original molded-on ladders so that I didn't have to touch the paint finish. The Moloco brake rigging was great, and got finished out with some "staples" bent out of P-B wire plus some brass rod for piping and linkages. Truth in advertising, I snagged some still shots from the Rapido youtube video to see how to detail the brake rigging...it was faster than finding prototype diagrams. I'm not huge on underframe detail, but these need something as it's visible on my eye-level track; as a result, I didn't aim for total duplication but did what was easy enough when I have great reference pics. To finish the car, tThe original COTS panel was removed with a q-tip dipped in automotive reducer. New COTS panels and wheel dots went on before weathering. Lower half of ends and underframe were airbrushed with TruColor PC green before weathering. Car was weathered with mainly AIM powder and a little oils...except the roof, which was a lot of oils. Next, car was patched using a cardstock mask and an airbrush, followed by CR reporting marks. The prototype had tape sealing the sliding door, which I duplicated with white decal stripes that got only minimal setting solution; my guess is that it was hauling paper and got sealed on account of not being a plug door. I used entirely on-hand bits/parts for this car, just for fun. The biggest cheat I made was to leave the factory road number...Conrail did not renumber these, and it was only an 80% model anyway. My notes show I paid $10 for the box car (maybe around 2008?) and added about $13 in on-hand parts...so $23 vs the $43 I paid for the Rapido. Other thoughts...the biggest thing missing from the factory P1K paint was the spring data on the bottom of the ends and the retainer valve marking. I couldn't get a good end shot to copy until after the car was finished. The thing that bugs me the most about the PC car is that the underframe and draft gear are black, not green--a pretty easy thing to have gotten right and a pain now that it's wrong. The second thing I noticed about the Rapido was that I could only get it to make NMRA weight of 6 oz if I left it in the packaging when I put it on the scale. I guess that's ok since I have to pull the underframe to repaint it anyway.... I have reference photos of another CR patched, this time with the small PC logo...so that is the likely fate of my new Rapido car. |
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Post by tom on Mar 16, 2022 17:19:45 GMT -8
Thanks for posting the comparison photos. Great weathering on that P1k car! That old P1K still holds up well against the new Rapido car showing that Life-Like took the time to get the dimensions right. I picked up the Rapido car too and it was so nice not to remove the ladders especially from the ends. One of the bigger problems with the P1K car was the roof in that it was modeled as an overhanging roof style vs the real car that Rapido modeled very well. The ends on Rapido car are also done much better too. The Rapido X72 seemed to have sold very well especially the PC version. Here is my redetailed/repainted Life-Like car.  My Rapido X72s will replace this one. |
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Post by markfj on Mar 17, 2022 13:58:22 GMT -8
Great work slowfreight!
So, should the underframe be painted green to match the body or black like Rapido has it? It’s not a big deal, just curious.
Thanks, Mark
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Post by riogrande on Mar 17, 2022 15:16:06 GMT -8
I've wondered about underframe colors in the past. It didn't make sense that the underframe would be painted the color of the sides, but maybe it is. I painted a Walthers RBL boxcar bottom black because it seemed odd that an Orange D&GW boxcar would be painted orange where you don't see the color. As for models, I've never really worried (other than that one case) about bottoms of boxcars since you can't see them while they are running on a layout.
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Post by slowfreight on Mar 17, 2022 15:29:56 GMT -8
Great work slowfreight! So, should the underframe be painted green to match the body or black like Rapido has it? It’s not a big deal, just curious. Thanks, Mark Generally, I am seeing that to avoid masking when painting, upon assembly freight cars get the same color on the underframe as the body. My ICG boxcar had orange underframes. The PC X58 is green underneath. These X72s were also green according to my reference pics. The paint achieves its goal of preventing corrosion and staying clean is of no concern. So easier than painting it black. |
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Post by markfj on Mar 17, 2022 15:32:50 GMT -8
I've wondered about underframe colors in the past. It didn't make sense that the underframe would be painted the color of the sides, but maybe it is. I painted a Walthers RBL boxcar bottom black because it seemed odd that an Orange D&GW boxcar would be painted orange where you don't see the color. As for models, I've never really worried (other than that one case) about bottoms of boxcars since you can't see them while they are running on a layout. Jim, I don’t know if that assumption is valid or not. There was a conversation about underframe painting on Pennsy cars on the Modern Freight Car List and apparently one method was to roll cars through the paint area where they received the same paint on the sides and underframe. Thanks, Mark |
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Post by slowfreight on Mar 17, 2022 16:33:43 GMT -8
As for models, I've never really worried (other than that one case) about bottoms of boxcars since you can't see them while they are running on a layout. True, and I only add underframe detail if visible at eye level--true on this car for sure. I really only worry about underframe color in that it carries through to the draft gear, which is very visible on many cars. |
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Post by tom on Mar 18, 2022 1:19:37 GMT -8
The PC X72s were purchased new and from photos of these cars when they were new it appears to me that the entire underframe was painted black.
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Post by markfj on Mar 18, 2022 3:49:34 GMT -8
Thanks Tom! That’s interesting to know because in this photo (which I shamelessly copied off eBay  ) of an X71 car with fresh paint in January of 72, you can see the coupler pocket is green and the trucks are black. The underframe could be either color. So, different manufacturer, different painting procedure I guess.  Thanks, Mark |
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Post by riogrande on Mar 18, 2022 4:15:50 GMT -8
I did some looking for PC Evans boxcars on RR-Fallen Flags and RailCarPhoto's. In every instance, the photo's only showed PC boxcars with the large logo. I didn't see any with the small logo. Is that anecdotal evidence that the large herald was the most common, or just the most photographed? Can anyone find small logo photos like the Rapido cars?
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Post by slowfreight on Mar 18, 2022 4:46:56 GMT -8
I did some looking for PC Evans boxcars on RR-Fallen Flags and RailCarPhoto's. In every instance, the photo's only showed PC boxcars with the large logo. I didn't see any with the small logo. Is that anecdotal evidence that the large herald was the most common, or just the most photographed? Can anyone find small logo photos like the Rapido cars? The one photo I have is a patched small logo car. Can't remember where I screen-scraped it. |
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Post by tom on Mar 18, 2022 4:53:12 GMT -8
I did some looking for PC Evans boxcars on RR-Fallen Flags and RailCarPhoto's. In every instance, the photo's only showed PC boxcars with the large logo. I didn't see any with the small logo. Is that anecdotal evidence that the large herald was the most common, or just the most photographed? Can anyone find small logo photos like the Rapido cars? See: www.rr-fallenflags.org/pc/pc269445d28.jpgThe X72 came with the small logo. A second order of the car came later with the bigger logo and this was the X72A. |
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Post by riogrande on Mar 18, 2022 5:01:15 GMT -8
Ahhh, when searching Fallen Flags, I was only looking at one number series. That splains it. RailCarPhoto's only seemed to show 2 photo's which were both large logo and I searched there by reporting mark and excluding number series.
Of course this is the fun of researching freight cars; I've learned now that there are at least two number series 229xxx and 269xxx for the PC Evans boxcars.
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Post by csxt8400 on Mar 18, 2022 10:46:50 GMT -8
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Post by sd80mac on Mar 18, 2022 12:31:37 GMT -8
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Post by tom on Mar 18, 2022 13:35:00 GMT -8
The elephant in the room hasn't arrived yet, I see. But you can find the door. I guess you are talking about the tab on the top panel of the door that that is on the Rapido X72 but not on the real X72? If so that is the only difference (other than the size of the logo) between the X72 and X72A. |
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Post by csxt8400 on Mar 18, 2022 14:08:44 GMT -8
The elephant in the room hasn't arrived yet, I see. But you can find the door. I guess you are talking about the tab on the top panel of the door that that is on the Rapido X72 but not on the real X72? If so that is the only difference (other than the size of the logo) between the X72 and X72A. While that is true, my main concern is the artwork is wrong nearly 100% across the entirety of the car. The lettering to the left of the door is improper in size and position. The numbers are also seemingly off, but hard to say without calipers. The right side of the car has an incorrect can opener length and position, which throws off the data as well. That to me makes this a laughable sell for a company that is supposed to be top tier, and I'm definitely not an anti Rapido person. I just find the shortfalls never ending on seemingly every release. |
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Post by lvrr325 on Mar 18, 2022 14:21:05 GMT -8
Is there any one standard for how Conrail repainted these things?
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Post by drsvelte on Mar 18, 2022 14:39:01 GMT -8
Here is one with the longer can-opener handle:  |
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Post by slowfreight on Mar 18, 2022 14:58:16 GMT -8
The second car is an x58 that is a mirror of my patched X58...green with a box car red door. |
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Post by surlyknuckle on Mar 18, 2022 15:14:26 GMT -8
slowfreight, that patched box is really sweet.
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Post by tom on Mar 18, 2022 15:40:24 GMT -8
[/quote]
While that is true, my main concern is the artwork is wrong nearly 100% across the entirety of the car.
The lettering to the left of the door is improper in size and position. The numbers are also seemingly off, but hard to say without calipers. The right side of the car has an incorrect can opener length and position, which throws off the data as well. That to me makes this a laughable sell for a company that is supposed to be top tier, and I'm definitely not an anti Rapido person. I just find the shortfalls never ending on seemingly every release.[/quote]
Oh I see it now. You're right. Rapido probably based the Conrail scheme on one Conrail car and then used that as a basis and then produced that scheme with multiple numbers. This method would work for the PC Evans factory built cars but not for the Conrail cars that were painted with different crews over time with the same basic scheme but with variations because of stencil changes or that it just did not matter that much.
Many model manufactures do repaints this way except perhaps for Moloco who has released cars with slightly different schemes on each side of the car to match the prototype.
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Post by kangaroose on Mar 18, 2022 16:30:06 GMT -8
Thanks for the compliments on repaints we try hard to verify all of them. That is why we sometimes just produce one Conrail car number. Nick quote author=" tom" source="/post/168492/thread" timestamp="1647646824"][/quote] While that is true, my main concern is the artwork is wrong nearly 100% across the entirety of the car. The lettering to the left of the door is improper in size and position. The numbers are also seemingly off, but hard to say without calipers. The right side of the car has an incorrect can opener length and position, which throws off the data as well. That to me makes this a laughable sell for a company that is supposed to be top tier, and I'm definitely not an anti Rapido person. I just find the shortfalls never ending on seemingly every release.[/quote] Oh I see it now. You're right. Rapido probably based the Conrail scheme on one Conrail car and then used that as a basis and then produced that scheme with multiple numbers. This method would work for the PC Evans factory built cars but not for the Conrail cars that were painted with different crews over time with the same basic scheme but with variations because of stencil changes or that it just did not matter that much.
Many model manufactures do repaints this way except perhaps for Moloco who has released cars with slightly different schemes on each side of the car to match the prototype. [/quote] |
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Post by csxt8400 on Mar 18, 2022 17:32:07 GMT -8
Oh I see it now. You're right. Rapido probably based the Conrail scheme on one Conrail car and then used that as a basis and then produced that scheme with multiple numbers. This method would work for the PC Evans factory built cars but not for the Conrail cars that were painted with different crews over time with the same basic scheme but with variations because of stencil changes or that it just did not matter that much.
Many model manufactures do repaints this way except perhaps for Moloco who has released cars with slightly different schemes on each side of the car to match the prototype.
[/quote]
Definitely likely. And Drsvelte's post has a much closer rendition to the car on Ebay for sure. Yet even on that "match" the Meadville way of "CONRAIL" is ignored and given too much space between letters and incorrect placement.
As it stands, Moloco and Tangent still seem to set the standard. Arrowhead should be hot on the heels when they start getting more product in on a regular basis. Exactrail is my favorite "most of the time" brand that gets more correct than not, but isn't immune to follies.
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Post by lars on Mar 19, 2022 4:02:04 GMT -8
Slow freight and Tom, nice looking models. I’m currently doing 2 of them and will hopefully get all the blemishes cleaned up this week. I found that carving off the side ladders was the hardest to get right as the molded ladders butt right against and are even overlap the end panel a bit. The new ladders will be placed tight to the ends which should hopefully disguise that a bit. While you have to follow the ribs on the ends, their shape and the ladder masks some carving imperfections.
I had some Detail Associates ladders on hand, but no more of those for me. First, they come in packs of 6, which is just about useless and they cost way too much for what they are. If you can add it to an order, the Exactrail ladders are much nicer.
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Post by slowfreight on Mar 19, 2022 7:21:25 GMT -8
Lars, I deliberately left the side grabs because I was able to get nearly the look of free standing without the headache and definitely came out ahead not affecting the paint on the side. Normally, I wouldn't do that in a project car.
Also, I only used the DW ladders because I had them left from a car that got Kadee ladders, which are my go-to upgrade part. I can always get the Kadee parts at my LHS.
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Post by lvrr325 on Mar 19, 2022 8:28:21 GMT -8
I'm going to guess that somewhere you will find a picture of an X72 that matches how Rapido painted them. They just then ran that with five other numbers.
I think it's easier for a Moloco or Tangent to do single number specific schemes. Rapido wants to sell you six packs of the cars, so I don't think they're even interested in doing one-off or oddball cars.
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Post by packer on Mar 19, 2022 9:31:59 GMT -8
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2022 14:10:02 GMT -8
I had previously committed to taking 2 cars or so from my friend's order. I picked up two large PC logo cars today. They roll actually much better than some other Rapido cars and the only issue I noticed is some of the metal stirrup steps are a bit of a loose fit and may need a touch of glue to not fall off. I am pleased they are metal.
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) of an X71 car with fresh paint in January of 72, you can see the coupler pocket is green and the trucks are black. The underframe could be either color. So, different manufacturer, different painting procedure I guess.
