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Post by MONSTERRAILROAD on Aug 3, 2013 23:06:13 GMT -8
I am not a subscriber of the Model Railroader magazine for many reasons (so much steam, no diversity, price,boring content) but I will usually flip the magazine while being held hostage in Walmart with my family when shopping. Well I saw the Septembers issue a day or so ago and thought that someone stole some pages because it was about half as thin. I honestly feel that MR magazine and RMC do their best to keep out minority contributors and they have done this historically and that stings so I just speak with my wallet by not subscribing and making very very limited purchases of MRR mag. I am not going to go all into that but I am just saying the issue was very, very thin. It makes me bring up the cost, what is the newer $5.99 price tag for, half the content of years before? They went up in prices many time in the past 7 years from about $4.50 to now $5.99 Newsstand price. As for the Railroad Model Craftsmen I will not buy ANY of their magazines because of something I saw in the magazine a few years ago but I still see them on the shelves, Well I USED to at least. Walmart used to carry them but does not anymore in my area, The owner of one hobby shop tells me that their magazine is always late to show up. It seems as though that is one magazine that is dying much more quickly than even MRR. I will not miss either one but it is what it is. I know a lot of people think the hobby is dying anyway but these magazines life certainly are dying at a foreseeable rate measured in years, at least in my opinion. $5.99 for a magazine that will sugar coat every "review" and NEVER be honest like people want to hear. The MRR seldom features modern layouts UNLESS it is their new guy in their clique name Pelle S. He is their new pet but otherwise you will not see modern layouts on a regular basis. You agree? Every month there is a Steam engine on a mountain layout, an early diesel rounding a bend on a layout or lastly MRR own personal fictional layout showing the work their people do in house.
It sure would be cool to have a magazine that was all about featuring layouts and the pictures of the layout. More than 4 or 5 of one HUGE gorgeous layout. you know what I mean. The MRR and RMC have the same set up of what to expect in it every month. One or two layouts with a few pictures, a HOW TO article, A DCC article, ads and reviews. I would like to see a layout that has a few layouts featured with a BUNCH of colored photos of the layout and a post link to the layout owners website to perhaps see more info. Also the magazine should have ads, but no HOW TOs, no reviews either. A magazine focused on model railroaders layouts every month with lots of pictures. Pictures sell magazines.
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Post by stevewagner on Aug 4, 2013 4:08:40 GMT -8
Railroad Model Craftsman and Railfan & Railroad have improved the timing of the delivery of their magazines considerably over the past few months. The August RMC actually arrived at the train store in Massachusetts where I work a few hours each month on or before July 31. Of course, by then the September Model Railroader was on the shelf.
As far as I'm concerned, the major flaw in Model Railroader's presentation of model railroads is that nearly all the photos show "finished" scenes, not work in progress. The late lamented Rail Model Journal was much better in that respect.
The best way to get the magazines to print more material on particular subjects is to submit some yourself and to urge others with the same interests to do so as well.
Of course, one reason that the amount of content in the commercial magazines is less than it was decades ago is that there are many fewer pages of advertising to support them. And that's almost surely mostly a function of increased sales via the Internet by sellers who don't find it necessary to advertise in the print media.
Your point on the too uniformly positive nature of reviews, especially in MR, is well taken. The last time I regularly read reviews in the modeling supplement to Germany's Eisenbahn magazine they were much more thorough, often featuring comparisons of different producers' models of the same type of locomotive or passenger car. Model Railroad News used to have more of that, too.
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Post by Brakie on Aug 4, 2013 6:11:24 GMT -8
I agree but,still enjoy reading MR.
As far as photos..I found photos can be a overkill..MRH comes to mind..Do we really need a photo of a hand using a hammer removing a track nail or a photo of a piece of flex track with push nails in it?
I almost forgot..A lot of MR's former content can be found in special issues and video plus.
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Post by atsfan on Aug 4, 2013 6:17:55 GMT -8
MR will be gone in 5 years. It is shrinking so fast as to be invisible. Ads are rapidly leaving as why bother?
MR will hang on like Life magazine with special editions and books.
MR has deinrately dumbed down itself starting with Andy S. it seems to thinks its readers are clueless rubes. Thus the content is pablum.
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Post by atsfan on Aug 4, 2013 6:31:01 GMT -8
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Post by riogrande on Aug 4, 2013 6:43:15 GMT -8
I honestly feel that MR magazine and RMC do their best to keep out minority contributors and they have done this historically and that stings so I just speak with my wallet by not subscribing and making very very limited purchases of MRR mag. I can only imagine what it is like to be in your shoes, but I have never thought MR magazine intentionally keep out minority contributors. If anything, they simply have a momentum of WASP middle to upper middle class culture extending back to the early days and it would take a lot purposed effort to change that. The hobby isn't cheap and therefore, those with nice layouts generally live in nice middleclass homes or larger etc. (I've had my share of hard times in past 13 years which is why I have no place to build a layout and my partiicpation in the hobby has been rather minimal due to not owning a home with space for even a small layout.) With the magazines in retreat mode, it makes it all that much harder to put resources into changing the "culture" of MR magazine from it's Milwaukee Wisconsin roots to something much more diversified. One can only hope. I don't think the hobby is dying. The recession of the past 5-6 years has hit many different markets hard, and then you couple that with the magazines disappearing or looking anemic, and people draw conclusions that are often false positives. Magazines as a media are going away because of the change over to electronic media, mainly the internet, period. Personally I still like reading magazines rather than sitting at a computer, but this is the direction of things and we can't stop it. I agree, I like to see more pictures, and the MR of the 80's and 90's used to be much richer in photo's. I only recently got a chance to visit my old library in central NY and yes, they still carry MR and RMC, unlike totally useless libraries in Fairfax County VA, and I sat down and thumbed through some 10-14 issues to quickly review the content. For my purposes, spending 20-30 minutes reading MR at the library was sufficient to enjoy it which is why I don't subscribe - just that I don't even have that where I live now. As it is, the magazines have dropped out of my life and the internet has largely replaced them. That tells the story basically why the magazines are going away.
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Post by upcsx on Aug 4, 2013 7:15:00 GMT -8
Does not MR have a Minority working for them.
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Post by atsfan on Aug 4, 2013 7:17:03 GMT -8
Here is an example. What now will MR next month (if that fast) tell you about the Athearn GP 50 that you don't already know? For that matter, the unit is sold out in many places already, so, even if MR was to put out a decent review and you decided to buy it, too late.
Model Railroad News is a MUCH better magazine. I would still pay money to ready what they have to say even though I already own the units !
MR will whitewash, dumb down, and write such a boring and uselesss "review" as to almost be an insult to anyone paying the money.
My biggest beef is that MR doesn't listen. Or care. Or bother. They are stuck in Milwaukee in a bubble of the 1950's or 1960's. So the hobby and money are passing them by.......
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Post by atsfan on Aug 4, 2013 7:21:07 GMT -8
Does not MR have a Minority working for them. Yes they do. Kalmbach even posted a video of him after he started.
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Post by riogrande on Aug 4, 2013 8:00:37 GMT -8
It's true, magazines simply can't be as fast as the internet news. Everyone has seen over the past 10+ years how we know about most products long before we see them in the magazines. No contest. Regarding reviews, it's true, MR's reviews have on the whole been fairly soft and fluffy; negative comments kept to a minimum. My own guess is they were very sensitive to offending their advertisers, who very often were those who's products were being reviewed (Atlas, Athearn, Walthers, KATO, and so on).
Whether or not MR listens or not, well, its like that with any business or service. I'm old fashioned and know how it goes, customers can walk if they product being offered isn't desired. If MR doesn't care, and the cusomter votes accordingly, it seems the handwriting is on the wall. But then again, maybe many magazines are already taking a fatal outlook and figure the die is cast and they will just keep on keeping on doing what they do until someone shuts it down or at least changes from hardcopy to electronic only.
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garr
Junior Member
Posts: 76
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Post by garr on Aug 4, 2013 8:25:18 GMT -8
True, it seems we are on the path to magazine extinction. However, if magazines find their niche, they will survive.
For example, as television matured, by all logic, radio should have disappeared, much as the telegraph virtually disappeared when radio matured. Yet radio transformed into a music/news/talk format from a drama format(basically a verbal TV of its day). As one of my guest professors(H. Randolph Holder of Athens, GA) in college back in the early '80s used to say, "Hear it now, see it tonight, read about it tomorrow". Technology of today has yet again blurred those lines, yet the increasing depth of coverage offered by each media in Mr. Holder's statement is pretty much still true today.
Or, putting it in our hobby terms, most people thought the interstates were going to be the death of the railroads. The '70s were bleak for most of the industry, yet railroads found their niche. Unit trains, automation, intermodal, rationalation thru spin offs or abandonments of marginal or unprofitable lines/branches, and crew reductions--basically converting themselves into conveyor belts. True Staggers probably had more to do with this resurgence than any other factor, but the railroads were smart enough use this as a spring board to transformation and relevance again.
In both examples, the key is adaptation to change. As long as magazines find ways to change in a relevant manner, they will survive.
Jay
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Post by crazyivan on Aug 4, 2013 8:39:12 GMT -8
Much as I do like some of the how to articles in both magazines, I dropped both some time ago for many of the reasons you already mentioned. What I found was many of the same subjects repeated, and laughable softball reviews. The previous mrr editor was also very rtr focused, so sit diy loco and car articles were very thin on the ground. That at least has improved.
If you want more demanding reviews, I quite like the nmra reviews. They tend to focus on standard compliance, and if something does not pass they are not shy about it.
I agree with you about modern and minority representation. As the boomers age out, the market is shifting toward modern equipment. Its already started, and it will only continue. If mrr chooses to ignore that, they do so at their peril. Personally, I'm modelling a fantasy post transition railroad because I enjoy the diversity of equipment that really does not exist in modern railroad (I see modern NS operations outside my office windows every day and I honestly can only tell the difference between ge and emd diesels when I look closely).
As for minority representation, I think this is still a symptom of both their location and history. I am seeing more minorities at shows all the time, and I think it's important for that voice to be present in the hobby press. I'd encourage you to blog, go on YouTube, start a podcast, submit articles to mrh. Get out there, be prolific, and help provide a voice in the community. We need all the positive, constructive voices we can get.
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Post by Brakie on Aug 4, 2013 8:55:48 GMT -8
Or, putting it in our hobby terms, most people thought the interstates were going to be the death of the railroads. The '70s were bleak for most of the industry, yet railroads found their niche. -------------------------------------- The trucking industry interstate almost killed the American railroad-look at the decaying 60s if you want evidence.
The 70s was the rationalization of the railroad plant and its rebirth thanks to deregulation..
Todays railroads is far more then unit trains and intermodal-neither would pay the bills..
General freight still accounts for millions of loads.
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Post by middledivision on Aug 4, 2013 9:28:39 GMT -8
I worked in the newspaper industry for 25 years. Print publications like newspapers and magazines have been on the decline for years. They need to embrace the internet but either don't care or don't know how. The future for both is limited publication... weekly or 2-3 times per week for newspapers and 3-4 times a year for magazines.
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Post by atsfan on Aug 4, 2013 9:43:54 GMT -8
Al is on youtube. His channel is always interesting.
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TA462
Junior Member
Posts: 88
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Post by TA462 on Aug 4, 2013 14:27:26 GMT -8
Over the years Model Railroader has got smaller but I think RMC has stayed about the same size. Model Railroader is a good magazine for getting people into the hobby. Their pictures and the layouts they show are usually great to look at. Their how to content for the most part is at the beginner level while RMC I think is for the more advanced modeller. I think MR gets a lot of ideas from their Forum. I've noticed for years that a hot topic usually ends up in print months down the road. I remember before I was BANNED FOR LIFE from their forum we were talking about how much detail is to much and the 20 inch rule. Guess who does a little write up about it? Neil did in his editorial this month.
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Post by riogrande on Aug 4, 2013 15:36:21 GMT -8
Over the years Model Railroader has got smaller but I think RMC has stayed about the same size. Model Railroader is a good magazine for getting people into the hobby. Their pictures and the layouts they show are usually great to look at. Their how to content for the most part is at the beginner level while RMC I think is for the more advanced modeller. I think MR gets a lot of ideas from their Forum. I've noticed for years that a hot topic usually ends up in print months down the road. I remember before I was BANNED FOR LIFE from their forum we were talking about how much detail is to much and the 20 inch rule. Guess who does a little write up about it? Neil did in his editorial this month. I have to agree with your assessment about MR magazine being a good magazine to get people into the hobby, which is a good thing! And to be honest, the content as I remember it for years was inspiring stuff and included what I would call advanced beginner and even intermediate level content. Mostly for me I read it because I enjoyed the articles about layouts and seeing how others designed their track plans etc. Of course before the internet you also learned about new products and read reviews etc. which were usefulto me in the 1980's and 90's. Yes, RMC was a bit more advanced although the presentation was never as good in terms of photo's, layout, graphics etc. The RMC reviews were more meaty and critical, and their articles were often very indepth. Some of my favorite articles were the 2 part Trailer Train and the Pacific Fruit Express. I found as my interests in the hobby and real railroads matured and developed, I moved over to magazines like Model Railroading and Rail Model Journal as my favorites (RIP!). I really miss those two. In the 1990's I resorted to just reading MR at the library and bought a lot of issues of MRG and RMJ and still have most of them. BTW, many of those are viewable on trainlife.com. Anyway, MR magazine is still doing what it always has, been a decent overall magazine aimed at introducing people to the hobby, making it attractive and providing some inspiration to the masses. Sadly, the meaty magazines that many moved onto after their interests grew are gone, so what replaces those things now? I suppose the internet to some degree.
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Post by antoniofp45 on Aug 4, 2013 17:06:38 GMT -8
Hey Al,
Good topic. It made me think a bit.
I've been modeling since the 1970s and did subscribe to MRR several times over the years. Eventually I resorted to purchasing individual issues here and there. But in the past 7 years I've turned mostly to the web as my source for model railroad related information and articles.
IMHO, the paper magazines are facing more competition from the web than ever.
Forums: Look at the enormous amount of information, photos, and mini-articles posted on this forum, MRR, Railroad.Net, Train Orders, The Diesel Detailer, the Yahoo Groups, etc. The internet is SATURATED with model railroad / rail fan related forums.
Online Magazines: Increasing in popularity featuring good articles. MRH comes to mind.
YouTube: Self explanatory. Al, you've got some really good vids online with my favorite being the drop bridge. In the past I would thumb through past MRR issues searching for "How to" articles. Now, I just type what I'm looking for it in the YouTube search bar and can easily find topics for: Scenery, DCC, DCC-Sound, Track laying, Painting, Locomotive Maintenance, Layout Construction, and other model railroad related "How To" vids. A lot of good info (as well as some that has to be scrutinized ). I'm planning on creating and posting an Alclad "How To" vid in the near future as some of the ones on there alarm me a bit.
Simplified Summary: The speed and convenience of the web has made an impact on the paper magazines.
Of course, it is still enjoyable to slow down and thumb through my old MRR mags, but I find myself behind the keyboard more often when searching for topics.
Magazine articles from minorities: (I'm one myself) I've seen articles posted by Black, Asian, and Hispanic modelers. If I'm not mistaken, the gentleman who first posted the Alclad article on metalizing those N-Scale RDCs back in 2003 was a minority. Keep in mind that there are quite a few modelers of all races and backgrounds that don't want to or don't have the time to go through the steps of writing up and posting a magazine article. Add to that, there's the intimidating feeling about "rejection". I've posted numerous Alclad threads on several forums because of how quickly it can be done on a keyboard. I recently spent quite a bit of time writing up an Alclad article for MRH back in April and it was time consuming! Yet, I don't know if it's been accepted or rejected. Now that's an online magazine. For Model Railroader Magazine the requirements, for me, are even more stringent and time consuming.
You've got some good videos yourself, yet you're aware how quickly you were able to organize your materials, shoot those videos and upload them to the Tube. Contrast that to sitting down for hours typing paragraphs, organizing them, re-wording some sentences, making sure your thoughts come across correctly, typing captions, organizing photos, and performing a lot of copying and pasting. For some modelers with full time jobs and families, that can be a challenge.
I don't want to see MRR disappear, but I'm in agreement with those that feel that eventually MRR will become a web based magazine.
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Post by MONSTERRAILROAD on Aug 4, 2013 17:23:31 GMT -8
Most of you guys remember my early days. Shoot I was raw and honest and it sometimes would rub people the wrong way. I would be busting outrageous jokes but people would think I was being serious and get offended quickly. I also cared what people said and I would react to smart a*ss comments with a more outrageous comment. It did get me banned from many forums but the Model Railroader Forum stood out as the one with the most issues. When I started building my layout it was February 12, 2003 and later that year joined the first forum. I was just 25 years old and had a quick to react attitude. I hated being censored by the forums who did not like when I said a product sucked or how someone did something. So in 2007 I started making videos on youtube and decided to start making my own how to videos and other videos about model railroading. I knew that the MRR magazine would never feature my layout and they spent much time censoring me so I figured in my videos I could say anything I wanted to. Look at my earlier videos man, they were rough, raw and grainy. I used to cuss in the videos and talk much crap. I look back at them and just giggle now. I would respond in my videos to any negative comments about me on the forums. I started to spend more time on my videos and making them good. I realized that my videos started to grow and get popular. People all over were watching them. I then got a better camera, started editing the videos, adding cool background music and lastly I stopped swearing as much and stopped responding to the negative comments as much. I got so much hating on me that I began to get used to it and started to just embrace the haters and let most of the comments roll right off my shoulder. I no longer cared about the haters and negative comments. I wanted to make more fun, entertaining videos. So as time had passed into years the subscribers went into 7,000+ and my son was born. I have spent the last 3 years featuring him in most of my videos. I have grown a lot in 9 years. Yes, I will admit that I am still edgy, prankster, busting jokes and do not take much BS but I know how to respond much better to stuff. I submitted my layout to the MRR magazine about 4 years ago and I was told from an editors assistant that my layout looked great and would be great in the magazine but the editors would not feature it. She started pointing out little dumb things on my layout like a car was out of scale and paint on a light pole and I said stop with the games and just tell me why. She said the editors would never feature my layout because I am Al Mayo aka Parkerlegend. It is cool though because I have done so much better featuring my layout in my own Youtube videos, sharing all my skills, giveaways and 'How To's', and I am very happy with that. Their magazine is for beginners and not for people like myself that have grown passed the simple content that they feature. Whenever they want to do a modern feature they only pull out their boy Pelle. Like he really knows how to weather, yeah right. There are many more people out there that really do weather models but anything modern that is featured in the magazine will be brought to you by him. They will make every single thing released by a manufacturer a "great buy" and "really good model" when it comes to their BS product reviews. According to them, "It's good, it's all good!" is their motto. In a few years they will be gone and you will only be able to get your reviews from JLWII2000. Well that is my little rant for now.
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Post by Dear Leader on Aug 4, 2013 17:48:07 GMT -8
I buy the issues that have Pelle's articles in them. Weathering is subjective. I think he does very well. I have watched your videos and you do very well. Between the both of you, as well as many others, my weathering has gotten better. Your graffiti is second to none. Everyone adds something to the hobby.
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Post by atsfan on Aug 4, 2013 18:17:37 GMT -8
I bought the two Pelle books. Got the secondhand but like new. Great stuff in them.
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Post by SOMECALLMETIM on Aug 4, 2013 18:24:35 GMT -8
I think Model Railroader has overreached with their Model Railroad Plus subscription service. Their magazine is already costly and add anther pay service that is not needed could spell disaster. Both MR and RMC offer digital subscriptions now. I am a long time subscriber to MR, but will reconsider when my subscription runs out next year. Too many free options and other sources available online.
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Post by bncascadegreen on Aug 4, 2013 18:40:25 GMT -8
MR is junk. I commented to them one time they should just have Pelle do books for them,thats all. The magazine is so bland that its not even worth thumbing thru. The only magazine worth anything to me is Railroads Illustrated from White River Publications,that brings me to Trains-not worth it anymore....the 80s 90s was Kalmbachs hay days and they are over.
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Post by jlwii2000 on Aug 4, 2013 19:32:34 GMT -8
Most of you guys remember my early days. Shoot I was raw and honest and it sometimes would rub people the wrong way. I would be busting outrageous jokes but people would think I was being serious and get offended quickly. I also cared what people said and I would react to smart a*ss comments with a more outrageous comment. It did get me banned from many forums but the Model Railroader Forum stood out as the one with the most issues. When I started building my layout it was February 12, 2003 and later that year joined the first forum. I was just 25 years old and had a quick to react attitude. I hated being censored by the forums who did not like when I said a product sucked or how someone did something. So in 2007 I started making videos on youtube and decided to start making my own how to videos and other videos about model railroading. I knew that the MRR magazine would never feature my layout and they spent much time censoring me so I figured in my videos I could say anything I wanted to. Look at my earlier videos man, they were rough, raw and grainy. I used to cuss in the videos and talk much crap. I look back at them and just giggle now. I would respond in my videos to any negative comments about me on the forums. I started to spend more time on my videos and making them good. I realized that my videos started to grow and get popular. People all over were watching them. I then got a better camera, started editing the videos, adding cool background music and lastly I stopped swearing as much and stopped responding to the negative comments as much. I got so much hating on me that I began to get used to it and started to just embrace the haters and let most of the comments roll right off my shoulder. I no longer cared about the haters and negative comments. I wanted to make more fun, entertaining videos. So as time had passed into years the subscribers went into 7,000+ and my son was born. I have spent the last 3 years featuring him in most of my videos. I have grown a lot in 9 years. Yes, I will admit that I am still edgy, prankster, busting jokes and do not take much BS but I know how to respond much better to stuff. I submitted my layout to the MRR magazine about 4 years ago and I was told from an editors assistant that my layout looked great and would be great in the magazine but the editors would not feature it. She started pointing out little dumb things on my layout like a car was out of scale and paint on a light pole and I said stop with the games and just tell me why. She said the editors would never feature my layout because I am Al Mayo aka Parkerlegend. It is cool though because I have done so much better featuring my layout in my own Youtube videos, sharing all my skills, giveaways and 'How To's', and I am very happy with that. Their magazine is for beginners and not for people like myself that have grown passed the simple content that they feature. Whenever they want to do a modern feature they only pull out their boy Pelle. Like he really knows how to weather, yeah right. There are many more people out there that really do weather models but anything modern that is featured in the magazine will be brought to you by him. They will make every single thing released by a manufacturer a "great buy" and "really good model" when it comes to their BS product reviews. According to them, "It's good, it's all good!" is their motto. In a few years they will be gone and you will only be able to get your reviews from JLWII2000. Well that is my little rant for now. I can't speak to the minority stuff, I haven't studied their articles enough to say who they don't include the articles. I thought because the hobby has so few minorities, that I didn't see many in the magazine because of the low ratio of minorities in the hobby. I know they have done some advanced modeling stuff, but nothing has really helped me out in their magazines. I haven't used one tip now that I think about it LOL. I'm not sure if they will be gone soon or not because they seem to have so much money. But man, let me tell you guys something that will blow your minds (or at least it blew my mind). One of my local hobby shops was ramping up their online store and they wanted to advertise a full page ad in the magazine. They quoted him $10,000 for ONE MONTH. That blew my mind, it's crazy what advertising fees they get. If you see the place, they all have the newest Apple computers and it seems pretty posh. So if they are struggling, I can't see it. I did some checking a few months ago and I think they had something like 600,000 subscribers to the magazine which is also insane to think about (if those numbers are fact). But here's where I think the future of the hobby is: Youtube: REAL PEOPLE, modeling, learning things, then turning around and teaching things. My approach was I'm stupid and you can learn with me as I mess stuff up and eventually learn to do it right. Al Mayo's approach was that he had already been modeling and he was going to show people how to do things with his experience. Neither of us will ever get the title of NMRA Master Model Railroader or whatever it's called. But we are real people learning at a pace on how to save money, how to model things, how to work around things, etc. It's also important to note that a lot of times we aren't traditional in our approaches. We do things the way we want and most of the time it works. I think Al is the go to guy for weathering, how to save money, and how to's. I am the review guy with a sprinkle of how to's. If you go back on youtube prior to the start of my reviews, you won't find many train reviews. If you go on youtube prior to Al's weathering videos, you won't find any how to's on weathering. Also email newsletters: A quick email from some company like Kalmbach or Model Railroad Hobbyist summarizing what's going on that week or month in the hobby. That is the future as well. So maybe the magazine will die soon, maybe not. But it just seems packed with ads. I think Kalmbach feels as long as they get their $ with ads then who cares about modeling articles. So the mag will get more ads and more ads and then eventually it will die. As far as accepting photos, I have never even attempted to submit a photo. Maybe one day soon I'll try and see what they say. I hear they have crazy high standards and thousands of entries each month. If they are denying Al Mayo because he is Al Mayo then that is flat out wrong. It seems though that every photo in that magazine is picture perfect. Nothing is out of place and if it's weathered then it's very neatly weathered. It's like the most perfect pollution and litter free little worlds. We all know Al's layout is far from perfectly neat and litter/pollution free. He shows the way it actually is in southern California, not a dream world. So I doubt they'll ever accept that type of scene. Lastly, We all know their reviews are just stating features. That's pretty much all it is. They buy models and get models free but no matter what they never say outright if there is a problem. As long as they do that, I'll be in business on youtube for reviews. If something is broken or jacked, you'll know about it because I'm pulling out of the box for the first time right in front of the camera. I don't hide anything and occasionally miss things, but I do what I can. I provide the real un altered view of what you're getting out of the box. With real people, not master modelers on youtube doing their thing, teaching, learning more, and engaging in discussion...this hobby will be just fine without the magazines. I will also be VERY HAPPY to get rid of the people that think they're better than others because they are perfect at all modeling aspects or because they have a lot of models or a perfect layout. That is the Model Railroader Magazine kinda people. Thinks they are better some how....I was in Roseville CA to visit a club layout and they told me I couldn't visit because some guy from model railroader was there and demanded they have it closed off to club members while he was working. I'm thinking who does this guy think he is?! But that's what you get with those guys sometimes.
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Post by Brakie on Aug 5, 2013 2:59:42 GMT -8
James,I have often mention the you tube tutorial videos on other forums and one time the very next poster suggested buying several Kalmbach books since those were written by "expert" modelers..In short the tutorial videos on you tube could be misleading and should be avoided.
I freely admit I have three Kalmbach books..One on EMD's Geeps,the American Short Line Guide and Railroads You Can Model.
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TA462
Junior Member
Posts: 88
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Post by TA462 on Aug 5, 2013 3:18:26 GMT -8
Most of you guys remember my early days. Shoot I was raw and honest and it sometimes would rub people the wrong way. I would be busting outrageous jokes but people would think I was being serious and get offended quickly. I also cared what people said and I would react to smart a*ss comments with a more outrageous comment. It did get me banned from many forums but the Model Railroader Forum stood out as the one with the most issues. When I started building my layout it was February 12, 2003 and later that year joined the first forum. I was just 25 years old and had a quick to react attitude. I hated being censored by the forums who did not like when I said a product sucked or how someone did something. So in 2007 I started making videos on youtube and decided to start making my own how to videos and other videos about model railroading. I knew that the MRR magazine would never feature my layout and they spent much time censoring me so I figured in my videos I could say anything I wanted to. Look at my earlier videos man, they were rough, raw and grainy. I used to cuss in the videos and talk much crap. I look back at them and just giggle now. I would respond in my videos to any negative comments about me on the forums. I started to spend more time on my videos and making them good. I realized that my videos started to grow and get popular. People all over were watching them. I then got a better camera, started editing the videos, adding cool background music and lastly I stopped swearing as much and stopped responding to the negative comments as much. I got so much hating on me that I began to get used to it and started to just embrace the haters and let most of the comments roll right off my shoulder. I no longer cared about the haters and negative comments. I wanted to make more fun, entertaining videos. So as time had passed into years the subscribers went into 7,000+ and my son was born. I have spent the last 3 years featuring him in most of my videos. I have grown a lot in 9 years. Yes, I will admit that I am still edgy, prankster, busting jokes and do not take much BS but I know how to respond much better to stuff. I submitted my layout to the MRR magazine about 4 years ago and I was told from an editors assistant that my layout looked great and would be great in the magazine but the editors would not feature it. She started pointing out little dumb things on my layout like a car was out of scale and paint on a light pole and I said stop with the games and just tell me why. She said the editors would never feature my layout because I am Al Mayo aka Parkerlegend. It is cool though because I have done so much better featuring my layout in my own Youtube videos, sharing all my skills, giveaways and 'How To's', and I am very happy with that. Their magazine is for beginners and not for people like myself that have grown passed the simple content that they feature. Whenever they want to do a modern feature they only pull out their boy Pelle. Like he really knows how to weather, yeah right. There are many more people out there that really do weather models but anything modern that is featured in the magazine will be brought to you by him. They will make every single thing released by a manufacturer a "great buy" and "really good model" when it comes to their BS product reviews. According to them, "It's good, it's all good!" is their motto. In a few years they will be gone and you will only be able to get your reviews from JLWII2000. Well that is my little rant for now. Al, I remember you from my early days and I honestly felt you were funny and told people the truth when they posted pictures. You were blamed for a lot of stuff on the MR Forum that you didn't do. The Forum now has become a little boys club and has lost most of the great modellers that use to go there for fun. Sure there are some great modellers still there but most of the posters now are wannabees. When the Trackside Dinner thread is the most popular thread on the forum it kind of tells you about the quality of the modelling content the forum has to offer.
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Post by atsfan on Aug 5, 2013 4:01:51 GMT -8
No way MR has 600k subs. The peaked at about 250,000. Last i checked it was about 140,000 i think. That was a while ago.
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Post by Brakie on Aug 5, 2013 4:52:09 GMT -8
Al, I remember you from my early days and I honestly felt you were funny and told people the truth when they posted pictures. You were blamed for a lot of stuff on the MR Forum that you didn't do. The Forum now has become a little boys club and has lost most of the great modellers that use to go there for fun. Sure there are some great modellers still there but most of the posters now are wannabees. When the Trackside Dinner thread is the most popular thread on the forum it kind of tells you about the quality of the modelling content the forum has to offer. --------------------------------------------- The only reason I stay on the MR forum is that was the first forum I sign up on followed by the old Atlas forum.
As far as wannabes I'm not to sure which is worst..Wannabe modelers that gives by the Kalmbach book answers or the wannabe experts..I suppose I could put one of each in a bag and shake the bag,turn the bag over and sees which one comes out first.
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TA462
Junior Member
Posts: 88
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Post by TA462 on Aug 5, 2013 5:13:38 GMT -8
I put them both in the same boat. Over there you have guys, usually the same guys that give answers to questions just because they read about it, not because they have real first hand experience and knowledge. Its too bad really. That Forum was great for me when I first started out, guys like BIG BOY who the Diner was named after, Joe Fugate and a number of other great modellers were a great source of information. Then they left. Now all the guys do is complain about the high cost of model railroading products every other day. The forum was taken over by a bunch of guys with little to no money that cling to each other like glue. They don't know how to model, are very poor at it or lie about what they have done. Its weird but that is what the MR staff wants for their forum.
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Post by Brakie on Aug 5, 2013 5:54:23 GMT -8
I also got the feeling there's a lot of kids over there too..I agree the quality of the posts has went down over the years as well..Many modelers has moved to better forums or maybe quit the hobby..We both seen those types.
I suspect Fugate has got his hands full with publishing MRH.
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