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Post by atsfan on Jul 3, 2014 6:25:26 GMT -8
If it is not an SD40-2 then it will be a let down.
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Post by carrman on Jul 3, 2014 10:50:23 GMT -8
Out of curiosity, was the original RPP body tooling cut in steel or aluminum? I think it was cut with a knife and fork from a block of recycled aluminum....;-) Dave
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Post by Brakie on Jul 3, 2014 11:58:43 GMT -8
Jim, I agree, the Details West tooling is almost 30 years old, and the Walthers cars is 20 or so years old. The 40 some year old Athearn 4740 tooling was great for its day but compared to the "current" generation offering from Tangent, it comes up short. Your right it is not a fair comparison. In the day, most cars had molded on detail, rather than separately applied details. That has changed. In fact Details West was one of the first to go with separate details in the late 1970's. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- I notice a lot of us is still buying those "old tooling cars" simply because we don't want to fork over Tangent prices and many of us know Atlas produced a Evans Double plug door boxcar in LNA&C which is a perfectly good car that sells between $14.99-19.95 on the street..Basically 2 for 1 over the Tangent cars.
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Post by buffalobill on Jul 3, 2014 13:15:03 GMT -8
Larry: The great thing about the Hobby is you can buy in at the price point that fits your needs and budget. If you want a low entry point, old Athearn blue box and other older models work work well. Particularly if you are able to pick them up in good shape at shows. If you want the detail and are willing to pay the price, you end up with Tangent, Exact Rail, Springs Mills etc. One of the issues is the new run Athearn PS-4740 is now at $30 list, for a couple of bucks list price higher, you can pickup a well detailed Intermountain car. Their "street" prices are not that Terribly different. My layout, if I ever get off my ass, and build it, will tend to show case the equipment, particularly the locomotives and cars, so a long time ago I made the decision, less better quality equipment, versus more less detailed stuff. Its all what we individually are comfortable with, and what works.
The Atlas car is the older, first generation of the Evans Blue Island DPD RBL, the car pictured is an entirely different, newer design, late 70's early 80's, Evans outside post car, with non terminating ends. I personally, have a bunch of the later run Atlas Evans RBL's, with separate ladders, and detailed underframe they are nice cars. Not every car needs to be a thirty or forty dollar car. Bill
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Post by Brakie on Jul 3, 2014 14:52:17 GMT -8
The great thing about the Hobby is you can buy in at the price point that fits your needs and budget. If you want a low entry point, old Athearn blue box and other older models work work well. ------------------------------------------------------- Bill,BB cars has fell from grace I now prefer the Roundhouse cars and the RTR FMC and other RTR former Roundhouse cars..Its been months since I bought a BB car.
I also have a 48 car collection of modern Athearn(RTR) Atlas,ER,IM and Red Caboose cars.These cars will soon become my home layout standard while the older BB and Roundhouse will be used as club cars or stored.
I have 2 Atlas Evans LNA&C boxcars I picked up for 2/$25.00 not bad seeing that's $12.50 ea for new cars-the shop was closing so,I cleaned up on some good deals-I figured I earned the right to be in on the picking since I spent wads of money in that shop.
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Post by riogrande on Jul 3, 2014 15:56:22 GMT -8
If you want the detail and are willing to pay the price, you end up with Tangent, Exact Rail, Springs Mills etc. One of the issues is the new run Athearn PS-4740 is now at $30 list, for a couple of bucks list price higher, you can pickup a well detailed Intermountain car. Their "street" prices are not that Terribly different. Bill The Athearn hoppers are different cars than the Intermountain, but I agree, I'm not sure how Athearn RTR CF4740's can compete against Intermountain CF4750 which sell at about $26 street price. I would imagine Athearns street price is only a few dollars less - no contest which which why I don't see myself buying anymore. The last RTR Athearn CF4740's I bought 6 or 7 years ago when I paid more like $12 to 14 for the couple I have. I would like to pick up some Tangent but at $40+ ea, maybe one or two at most for now. Cheers, Jim
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Post by Brakie on Jul 3, 2014 16:40:17 GMT -8
The Athearn hoppers are different cars than the Intermountain, but I agree, I'm not sure how Athearn RTR CF4740's can compete against Intermountain CF4750 which sell at about $26 street price. I would imagine Athearns street price is only a few dollars less - no contest which which why I don't see myself buying anymore. The last RTR Athearn CF4740's I bought 6 or 7 years ago when I paid more like $12 to 14 for the couple I have. I would like to pick up some Tangent but at $40+ ea, maybe one or two at most for now.
Cheers, Jim ---------------------------------------- Jim,They can't and seeing those are old BB cars..
Even I would opt out for the IM covered hopper.$22.49(street)Athearn vs.$26.29(street)for the IM covered hopper.
The choice should be a no brainer after all what's $4.00 a Big Mac and Coke?
Prices quoted from MBK.
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Post by atsfan on Jul 3, 2014 18:03:23 GMT -8
If you want the detail and are willing to pay the price, you end up with Tangent, Exact Rail, Springs Mills etc. One of the issues is the new run Athearn PS-4740 is now at $30 list, for a couple of bucks list price higher, you can pickup a well detailed Intermountain car. Their "street" prices are not that Terribly different. Bill The Athearn hoppers are different cars than the Intermountain, but I agree, I'm not sure how Athearn RTR CF4740's can compete against Intermountain CF4750 which sell at about $26 street price. I would imagine Athearns street price is only a few dollars less - no contest which which why I don't see myself buying anymore. The last RTR Athearn CF4740's I bought 6 or 7 years ago when I paid more like $12 to 14 for the couple I have. I would like to pick up some Tangent but at $40+ ea, maybe one or two at most for now. Cheers, Jim The old Athean PS hooper is now $30? I must have missed that.
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Post by jbilbrey on Jul 3, 2014 18:32:29 GMT -8
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Post by Brakie on Jul 3, 2014 18:33:12 GMT -8
The Athearn hoppers are different cars than the Intermountain, but I agree, I'm not sure how Athearn RTR CF4740's can compete against Intermountain CF4750 which sell at about $26 street price. I would imagine Athearns street price is only a few dollars less - no contest which which why I don't see myself buying anymore. The last RTR Athearn CF4740's I bought 6 or 7 years ago when I paid more like $12 to 14 for the couple I have. I would like to pick up some Tangent but at $40+ ea, maybe one or two at most for now. Cheers, Jim The old Athean PS hooper is now $30? I must have missed that. You know about the old BB "Railbox" 50' boxcar? Only $26.95 ($19.99 street) even comes with the door "claws"..
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Post by atsfan on Jul 3, 2014 18:46:32 GMT -8
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Post by atsfan on Jul 3, 2014 18:47:16 GMT -8
The old Athean PS hooper is now $30? I must have missed that. You know about the old BB "Railbox" 50' boxcar? Only $26.95 ($19.99 street) even comes with the door "claws".. Horizon just must be completely dreaming.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2014 19:25:17 GMT -8
I would love to see them do a Union Pacific CA-11 caboose in the Genesis line...if they were going to do a freight car...But I think the SD40 is the "revised" model...
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Post by bdhicks on Jul 3, 2014 20:38:00 GMT -8
A retooled GP60 and a brand-new FL9.
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Post by riogrande on Jul 4, 2014 3:15:47 GMT -8
As I recall, some of these RTR versions of blue box cars have been priced like that for the past couple years so this isn't breaking news. Compared to other models out there that are less crude and more detailed for nearly the same prices, there are certainly better bargains. Athearn probably continues to offer them because apparently they sell. It's gotta be gravy as those molds must have been paid for many moons ago.
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Post by Brakie on Jul 4, 2014 4:30:31 GMT -8
As I recall, some of these RTR versions of blue box cars have been priced like that for the past couple years so this isn't breaking news. Compared to other models out there that are less crude and more detailed for nearly the same prices, there are certainly better bargains. Athearn probably continues to offer them because apparently they sell. It's gotta be gravy as those molds must have been paid for many moons ago. Jim,As I mention on page two the price difference between those old BB cars and cars from IM,Atlas,ER,FVM and Red Caboose isn't all that much at street. Same for Athearn's Geneses cars is about the same price as IM,ER,FVM and of course Atlas. Confession time..I didn't really compare street prices until this topic and in that light(actually common sense kicked in) think I will add some more supped up cars for home use instead of the older Roundhouse kits. I already have 48 and I need around 12 more for car rotation like I mention on page two in my reply to Bill. Car rotation is a must on a ISL-gee,there's that dented Railgon again..With car rotation that car can be off the layout for several operation sessions.
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Post by riogrande on Jul 4, 2014 4:53:02 GMT -8
You would be right Larry. The difference isn't all that much and for me, I'd go for the nicer freight car for a few dollars more any day!
That said, I usually choose freight cars based on what I need or what fits my modeling scheme. I try to find cars which are accurate and most of the time shop for them based on whats a good match to the prototype for my era and location. Given that I could get an Athearn RTR car based on a blue box mold, vs. a same/similar car from Atlas, Genesis, ExactRail, Intermountain etc., the latter would win every time!
I own maybe 3 or 4 Athearn RTR cars based on the old blue box version I bought 6 or 7 years ago for around $12 each. I don't see many of the RTR Roundhouse cars lately for sale other than the coal cars Athearn has continued to offer. I have 100 souped up Hi side coal gons, and 40 of the souped up 5 bay rapid discharge hoppers (CSDU/CSDPU).
The weird thing about Athearn RTR line is, it includes some much nicer, more detailed cars, along side warmed over blue box models. Some are really nice, others fairly crude under the paint jobs and show their old heritage. IMO, Athearn should have divided the non-genesis line into heritage and deluxe or something. They generally have priced the better RTR stuff a little more.
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Post by Brakie on Jul 4, 2014 5:14:18 GMT -8
Those Roundhouse RTR FMC boxcars isn't that bad of a car however, there is one issue like their Athearn BB/RTR AFC brothers they're a foot to wide.
I run my wide cars together and my scale width cars together..Of course I can't see then foot difference while switching cars.
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Post by atsfan on Jul 4, 2014 5:18:46 GMT -8
The Athearn PS Hopper mold is at least 30 years old. Not that long ago the list price of the RTR version was $14. To have it at $30 is mind boggling. (same exact car also made in China). Glad I have all I need especially from the kits.
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Post by jbilbrey on Jul 4, 2014 9:11:48 GMT -8
The Athearn PS Hopper mold is at least 30 years old. Not that long ago the list price of the RTR version was $14. To have it at $30 is mind boggling. (same exact car also made in China). Glad I have all I need especially from the kits. I agree. I could somewhat understand the price increase if Athearn had retooled the car and replaced the plastic roofwalk with a P-E part as they did with the FMC 4700 boxcar:
www.athearn.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=ATH73878
However, the Athearn PS 4740 model looks crude next to just about any other covered hopper out there right now. If I needed a P-S 4740 covered hopper and had to choose between the $30 Athearn car and the $40 Tangent hopper, I'll go with Tangent.
James Bilbrey LaVergne, TN
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Post by carrman on Jul 4, 2014 9:45:34 GMT -8
A retooled GP60 and a brand-new FL9. Well, we are getting an all new GP60 and an FL9, just not from Athearn! Dave
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Post by edwardsutorik on Jul 4, 2014 9:56:01 GMT -8
The Athearn PS Hopper mold is at least 30 years old. Try 43 years old--introduced in early 1971. So the molds would go back to 1970, anyway. But they're still making the Santa Fe caboose, and that goes back at least to 1957--about 56 years. And they say molds "wear out". Ed
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Post by carrman on Jul 4, 2014 10:09:41 GMT -8
Depends on what kind of material they were cut from. Athearn used to have everything cut from tool steel, but that changed to aluminum after the SD70M's.
Dave
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Post by nebrzephyr on Jul 4, 2014 12:10:43 GMT -8
Athearn also changed (improved) the end cages on the old MDC FMC hopper in addition to the metal roof walk. Bob
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Post by buffalobill on Jul 4, 2014 12:22:56 GMT -8
Athearn did a serious upgrade on the old MDC FMC-4700 when they re-released it. It is a nice car now. They have not really done much for the old PS-4740 except paint the underframe the proper color, the underframe, ends, and details were molded in black, and upgrade the trucks and add metal wheel sets. When introduced it had a list price of $2.98, and was really state of the art. One of the first Athearn cars to be an accurate depiction of the prototype. Times change. Bill
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Post by fmilhaupt on Jul 5, 2014 5:41:41 GMT -8
A retooled GP60 and a brand-new FL9. Well, we are getting an all new GP60 and an FL9, just not from Athearn! Dave I'm thinking DD35 and DD35A. They got close to the DD35A before.
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Post by riogrande on Jul 5, 2014 6:30:28 GMT -8
Well, we are getting an all new GP60 and an FL9, just not from Athearn! Dave I'm thinking DD35 and DD35A. They got close to the DD35A before. Where were the DD35A's in relation to other loco's on the poll Athearn had?
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Post by jbilbrey on Jul 5, 2014 19:20:14 GMT -8
I was told that the SD40 WOULD be completely redone, and as a prototype modeler, I'd be really happy with the results. What I wasn't told was when....;-) My personal wish to see as the "completely revised one" would be a CSX SD40-2 VMV/M-K rebuild that used a SD40 core. A yet-to-be-announced SD40 has been speculated since Athearn upgraded the SD45 chassis to make it more sound-friendly as well as capable of accepting Genesis parts. This is somewhat the reverse of what Athearn did when they upgraded their SW1500; it shared the cab, cab interior, and couple other minor parts with the Genesis MP15AC. James Bilbrey LaVergne, TN
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Post by bigblow69 on Jul 5, 2014 20:47:13 GMT -8
Just give me a frac sand hopper and I'd be satisfied.
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Post by Weed Weasel on Jul 6, 2014 12:09:01 GMT -8
This is different. What happened to the requests for an Amtrak SDP40F? Everytime Athearn says new locomotive it's right at the top. This time no mention.
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