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Post by MONSTERRAILROAD on Mar 10, 2015 7:10:22 GMT -8
Ok so I just got my one engine delivered to me (yesterday 03.09.15). As I said before, I had two on pre-order but recently called and cancelled one after my most recent issue with the Genesis GP38-2 I got a couple of months ago. Well here is a straight honest and good review comparing the engine next to #1- Previous Genesis SD70M run, #2- OMI SD70M Flared #3- A custom kitbashed Genesis SD70M flared/phase II I made a few years ago. Well enjoy. Monsterrailroad Youtube |
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Post by calzephyr on Mar 10, 2015 8:18:15 GMT -8
Thanks Al for the review! The handrails are always a problem on most plastic models. That is probably one of the reasons you still have the Overland models!
Larry
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Post by bigb6flyer on Mar 10, 2015 9:30:27 GMT -8
My Athearn UP SD70M was delivered to my home yesterday, but as I'm on the road til later this week, I've yet to see it. I've seen Al's review, and I undertand his concerns. I'm not defending Athearn, but I can say that color perception is very subjective and individualized. What's blue to me is green to you. For example, look at the blue or gold dress that went viral on the web last week. My wife thought I had 3 heads when I told her it looked gold to me. She said it was blue to her. If you don't know what I'm talking about, Google it or call a female friend. As I said in the comments to Al's video and he said himself in the video, it appears as though his locomotive looks pre-faded. As these locomotives are a decade old, that makes them look more prototypical. To me that's not a big deal as it just saves me a step in weathering it. But if your a purist and like your fleet to look the same as it did the day it rolled out of the factory, it appears you may be disappointed. The blue on the front winged emblem is more difficult to evaluate. I'm not a UP expert, and this will only be my 4th UP loco. I'm getting #4737 so I did some comparison of Athearn's website photo and some various prototype photos. In some pics it looks spot on, in others the models wings look lighter blue than the prototype. This could be due to the camera, light, weathering on the prototype, or age; or it could be Athearn got it wrong, at least for a brand new, fresh from the factory locomotive. Here's the Athearn photo: www.athearn.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=ATHG69289Here the prototype looks very blue like Al's older Athearn release and the OMI and not like the new release: www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1679442Here the prototype blue winged emblem looks a lot like the new Athearn release: www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=243036These two prototype photos were only taken 14 months apart. I show it was built in 01/2002. These are all how I perceive these pictures. You may differ. So to me this means that the Athearn latest release at best represents a lightly weathered model that's seen a couple years of prototype use. At worst, it's completely off to a loco fresh out of the factory in color. As I said, paint color is all about perception in the eye of the viewer and is influenced by camera work, lighting, age, and human individuality. I look forward to seeing my locomotive. Im 99% sure I'll keep it. I'm one who looks largely past glue goofs as having painted a few Undecorated/stripped models and kit bashed several more, I know that happens. And when I kitbash my own models, it typically costs me more than what you can get a factory new plastic model for after you add all the details, Loksound or Soundtraxx, high bass speaker, etc. I'm currently building a CSX SD40-3 Kato. Brad |
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Post by middledivision on Mar 10, 2015 10:55:39 GMT -8
No excuse for the color screw-ups.
Hopefully, they got the black and white right on my NS units!
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Post by atsfan on Mar 10, 2015 11:37:54 GMT -8
Good review, although how does it run Al?
Athearn handrails are bad. This model was tooled way back as a kit and the handrails then were a nightmare.
Glad I did not ore order one.
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Post by MONSTERRAILROAD on Mar 10, 2015 12:35:24 GMT -8
Well atsfan I have yet to install the decoder but I be straight up and say that my experience with how Athearns run has always flawless. That is their strongest point in fact. I will add a TCS KAT24 which is a plug and play decoder with a Keep Alive capacitor inside. First I will install the LEDS and then the decoder and TRY to figure out how in the heck to wire them to the board with that kind of decoder. To be honest, If I was not going to review the model and had the option of seeing it in the hobby shop before purchasing it, I would have inspected it and highly likely passed up on the sale, but that is just me. Now if the non sound version in the hobby shop was $99, well then I would purchase it for sure. But I paid $163 or so for mine. I was more glad that I was doing more business with Overland Hobbies than actually getting the model. We'll see how this model turns out after the LEDS are installed and after it is weathered. Nothing will change the fact that the handrails suck and WILL ultimately break and warp after a short period of time and after some CAREFUL handling. That is inevitable no matter what!!  |
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Post by WP 257 on Mar 10, 2015 19:51:34 GMT -8
Big Al--
Just got around to watching the review.
Ouch! Well, I want to thank you for keeping it real and giving us the unvarnished truth.
There's nothing for me to say that hasn't already been said on the video.
Glad I don't pre-order from them.
John
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Post by Judge Doom on Mar 10, 2015 20:28:48 GMT -8
Skipped to the end, didn't see it in two parts, not sure if I should watch the rest.  |
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Post by stevef45 on Mar 10, 2015 22:56:39 GMT -8
LOved the review. To me the yellow almost looks like it was applied over the grey, instead of the grey going over the yellow where its needed. The front wing/logo looks absolutely terrible. Much smaller and the blue is just off. Does anyone know if the prototype itself has a smaller wing/logo?
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Post by Judge Doom on Mar 11, 2015 0:52:04 GMT -8
The colour of the shield doesn't look too far off the prototype after a few years of service. Colours do fade or shift a bit over time when subject to the sun.  Also something to think about: if enough people hold off buying, that might in effect sabotage the likelihood of getting an improved version for a long time. Athearn's gonna look at the low sales and conclude demand for that particular model in that livery is low, so they might not do a rerun for many years (and the price for those existing models goes up, which is the opposite of your scenario in the video). It may or may not also affect how many of the other SD70 versions of UP units they produce. |
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Post by atsfan on Mar 11, 2015 6:21:30 GMT -8
So now we need to buy bad products in order to some day get a correct product?
It's moot anyway since these sold out a year ago.
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Post by Judge Doom on Mar 11, 2015 7:36:40 GMT -8
So now we need to buy bad products in order to some day get a correct product? It's moot anyway since these sold out a year ago. Well, look at all the southeastern roads that never get rerun because they apparently don't sell well... |
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Post by atsfan on Mar 11, 2015 8:43:24 GMT -8
So now we need to buy bad products in order to some day get a correct product? It's moot anyway since these sold out a year ago. Well, look at all the southeastern roads that never get rerun because they apparently don't sell well... Not popular is different than defective. |
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Post by WP 257 on Mar 11, 2015 9:38:04 GMT -8
There's a difference. Some southeastern roads, including SCL C-430's as a real example, sold so very poorly on the first run that the importer jokes openly that "we couldn't give them away", and has stated they will likely never be rerun--and there were no quality issues (known to me) with how they were done. That means either: a. would-be buyers didn't trust the importer in the first place to deliver a good product for whatever reason (fill in the blank here), or b. after the product was out and on the street and available to be had, they were still too cheap to buy them or c. nobody really wanted them in the first place. The actual answer might be a little bit of all of the above. Suffice it to say, at least that one importer now believes that "southeastern doesn't sell" and they still have the SCL engines sitting on the warehouse shelf, available for purchase, in all road numbers (but without sound). That can't be good for their bottom line.
Here in PA there are multiple train dealers still showing Atlas Seaboard Air Line C-420's as being in stock, actually on shelves, multiple years after they were built. Apache Railway has been a better seller around here.
Maybe southern railfans just hate Alcos? I don't know why they haven't sold. Considering the history of the Seaboard fast freight service, and the fact that for a time they had the fastest scheduled freight train in the U.S., occasionally pulled by Alcos, one might have thought they'd have sold out long ago.
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Post by calzephyr on Mar 11, 2015 9:57:21 GMT -8
The colour of the shield doesn't look too far off the prototype after a few years of service. Colours do fade or shift a bit over time when subject to the sun. Also something to think about: if enough people hold off buying, that might in effect sabotage the likelihood of getting an improved version for a long time. Athearn's gonna look at the low sales and conclude demand for that particular model in that livery is low, so they might not do a rerun for many years (and the price for those existing models goes up, which is the opposite of your scenario in the video). It may or may not also affect how many of the other SD70 versions of UP units they produce. Looks like Athearn plastic handrails on the front. The Union Pacific should lay some tracks for these units. Anyone know the location of this accident?? thanks Larry |
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Post by riogrande on Mar 11, 2015 10:07:33 GMT -8
It's interesting on what sells and doesn't sell. Of course there are plenty who constantly call out for their favorite un-made loco and road name, but it obviously matters and any company making diesels is taking a calculated risk. I only know that my favorite road didn't used to seem so popular with makers of HO diesels, but any doubt seems to be erased in the past 8-10 years. Seems 1980's and 1990's D&RGW and modern UP is very popular. SP too.
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Post by bigb6flyer on Mar 11, 2015 10:12:50 GMT -8
Larry, www.railpictures.net/photo/376896/The accident occurred in Alington, TX in 2011. It was the lead unit and ran a stop signal and collided with the back of an intermodal train (last container was apparently green (: ). 4258 was repaired and is still in service.... Brad |
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Post by calzephyr on Mar 11, 2015 10:54:05 GMT -8
Larry, www.railpictures.net/photo/376896/The accident occurred in Alington, TX in 2011. It was the lead unit and ran a stop signal and collided with the back of an intermodal train (last container was apparently green (: ). 4258 was repaired and is still in service.... Brad Thanks Brad That probably means the crew running the 4258 is no longer employed by the Union Pacific. Larry |
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Post by bigblow69 on Mar 11, 2015 12:08:47 GMT -8
All my locos that are UP are different shades of even from the same manufacturer. I'd prefer semi-gloss finish on the models. I agree with the observation that subsequent runs will probably be better quality as far as the manufacturing process goes.
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Post by ramblingrimace on Mar 11, 2015 15:46:59 GMT -8
Man everyone complains about the handrails all of my engines have no problem warping or bending, in fact I want Athearn to keep using the thin handrails because they do look better than the metal ones. Also I HATE LED's in my models everyone asking to have to switch to LED's should stop or just install them themselfs, I want my models to have the headlight look real with a lens in it and you know how you do that WITH A REAL LIGHT BULB! All of my engines that have LED's, I've ripped out and installed real bulbs and that was aggravating.
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Post by jlwii2000 on Mar 11, 2015 17:03:09 GMT -8
Opinions are like buttholes. Everybody's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks. Some people love Athearn, some people hate Athearn. So far, I have 3 of the 5 SD70M's I bought have arrived. I spread out my business to Overland Hobbies, TrainWorld, and Train Time Hobby (my LHS). The 3 that have came in look fine so far. No broken handrails, minor glue spots if I look super closely. Sometimes you get good models and sometimes you get bad models. I have gotten bad ones before, if its bad enough I pack it up and send it back and demand one in shape unless it's an easy fix just like any modeler. So the LED and handrail debate go on and on. I will say the people wanting LEDs and metal hand rails is a large crowd but there's still many happy with the models the way they are. Maybe I'm just too laid back since I am overall very happy with most models regardless of which company it's from. The most angry I've ever been about a model was actually my Overland Models Boy scout unit. They only produced 11 and got the wrong color on the side. But even that I forgave because after all, its up to a factory worker who is having a good or bad day on whether I'll have a good or bad model. If I get the model that was pushed through right before a Chinese factory worker is leaving for vacation or after a long day, chances are I'm screwed and my model will have issues. If I get the fresh Chinese factory worker who just woke up and had a giant cup of Taster's choice or Folgers coffee I might get a flawless model. It's what I call the model lottery. -James |
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Post by atsfan on Mar 11, 2015 17:31:43 GMT -8
Not so much metal handrails, handrails that are not warped or bent, or get so in a light breeze.
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Post by atsfan on Mar 11, 2015 17:34:02 GMT -8
Man everyone complains about the handrails all of my engines have no problem warping or bending, in fact I want Athearn to keep using the thin handrails because they do look better than the metal ones. Also I HATE LED's in my models everyone asking to have to switch to LED's should stop or just install them themselfs, I want my models to have the headlight look real with a lens in it and you know how you do that WITH A REAL LIGHT BULB! All of my engines that have LED's, I've ripped out and installed real bulbs and that was aggravating. Interesting second post. Which engines and brands did you rip out the LEDs? |
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Post by curtmc on Mar 11, 2015 17:45:01 GMT -8
James,
That's a darn good theory... Similar to the automobiles on an assembly line and those pushed out first thing on Monday or last thing on Friday, when compared to those that rolled out midday on a Tuesday... (During summers in college I worked at a school bus assembly plant and the first ones and last ones of the week had higher correction lists on final inspections)
By the way, on the OMI UP 2010, 15 were made... And your reaction was similar to mine (before the correction).
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Post by jlwii2000 on Mar 11, 2015 17:51:54 GMT -8
James, That's a darn good theory... Similar to the automobiles on an assembly line and those pushed out first thing on Monday or last thing on Friday, when compared to those that rolled out midday on a Tuesday... (During summers in college I worked at a school bus assembly plant and the first ones and last ones of the week had higher correction lists on final inspections) By the way, on the OMI UP 2010, 15 were made... And your reaction was similar to mine (before the correction). Yeah 15 made, that's right. I forgot. Around $2,000 for that model and I still didn't get too upset. I guess I'm just low blood pressure now as I get older. On the handrails and LED's I get it, I just get tired of saying they should be one way in a video then a large portion of the crowd disagrees so now I generalize more and try to consider everyones perspective and let people decide. No real reason for me to say my way or the highway on stuff. Curt your point on the workers at the bus factory is a great example. This isn't Athearn's fault directly. You can be upset at Athearn for weight, handrails, bulbs, etc. Those are decisions they make but a bad model is sometimes out of their control. Now QC could be ramped up as well but I don't know how that works or what all they look at. Intermountain test runs every locomotive but I still hear of people having issues with their locos too. I guess no guarantees in life or model railroading.  -James |
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Post by MONSTERRAILROAD on Mar 11, 2015 17:55:18 GMT -8
Athearn Genesis motors - Top notch, very very good!
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Post by TBird1958 on Mar 11, 2015 17:59:37 GMT -8
Man everyone complains about the handrails all of my engines have no problem warping or bending, in fact I want Athearn to keep using the thin handrails because they do look better than the metal ones. Also I HATE LED's in my models everyone asking to have to switch to LED's should stop or just install them themselfs, I want my models to have the headlight look real with a lens in it and you know how you do that WITH A REAL LIGHT BULB! All of my engines that have LED's, I've ripped out and installed real bulbs and that was aggravating. Interesting second post. Which engines and brands did you rip out the LEDs? I take them out of Kato units, the ones in the SD45s were blue. |
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Post by WP 257 on Mar 11, 2015 21:08:51 GMT -8
Big Al--
I'm fine with LED's or bulbs, as long as they work...and there's times at night that I think the NS units around here almost have a bluish tint to their lights, but that's me.
The attraction for me is that LED's will last a long time and Athearn's bulbs have been proven...not to last. I'd rather have something that will last, regardless of whether it's white or bluish or amber.
John
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Post by bigb6flyer on Mar 12, 2015 4:36:22 GMT -8
LED technology has come a long way from when it was first introduced in models. With sunny white or golden white, you get a good representation versus the bluish tint of older leds. And as another poster said, the huge attraction is they virtually last forever if installed correctly versus bulbs which have an indetermined life span. I've never had broken handrails on an Athearn, but I've certainly had a share that pop out. A little canopy glue keeps them in place.
Brad
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Post by middledivision on Mar 12, 2015 7:36:53 GMT -8
My sound and non-sound NS Flares, from two different suppliers, arrived yesterday and both are perfect. Just like the Ace and SD70M-2's.
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