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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2018 3:43:21 GMT -8
The Pennsy cars will be just perfect for my modeling needs. I was going to re-stencil them for the 1979-1982 era.
Looking forward to mine.
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Post by roadkill on Aug 7, 2018 4:45:28 GMT -8
All, As careful as I tried to be in the development of this model, I have to own the error in the CAPY data as a true oversight. Unfortunately, this may turn some people away from the model, and insofar as that is the case, I will own that too. I can tell you that no one is more bothered by it then myself. I am pleased to say that this is the only error that has come to light in the production, which has been very complex. That said, there is a lack of proportion to some commentary on the matter such that I want to add a note: if a prophet descended from the ethers of infinite space and declared that a mistake must be made and that I must choose my error, this would be it. Why? Because, it is not a tooling error. It is not a primary or secondary color error. It is not an error to the primary or secondary logos or the logotypes--these are impeccable rendered. It is an error to a tertiary stencil on the car. One that is 0.034443" tall in the artwork--a numeral interposed among a string of characters on stencil that, on the prototype, didn't last for very long anyway. As most people know, most of these cars re-stenciled when reweighed--which translates to: if a person wanted to correct it, they could be a less than artful modeler and the stencil would still seem prototypical because re-weigh stencils rarely matched the original. If a mistake had to be made that would cross the threshold of noteworthy, I would choose this kind of error--every day. My point: I would genuinely prefer to not ever make an error anywhere. (After all, I tooled separate parts to account for different styles of dimensionally accurate defect card holders on the slope sheet bulkheads, which detail alone added entire man-days to the project.) But the other truth is, manufactures don't operate at perfect, and even the best manufacturers have made mistakes more egregious. Which, I would very much prefer not to point to in the spirit of goodwill. And, the only reason I mention that is because, again, the proportions of some comments are made with the aegis of categorical imperatives. By the way, I want to speak to the assumption that I didn't work with anyone from the PRR society in the development of this project. I did. They were helpful with the resources that they had, and my errors are not their fault. I own the project. But, I wasn't working alone or in a box. One more note because it is a developing conversation: there is a builder's photo of PRR 666166 Pullman-Standard 2603 HT on page 228 of the Car Builder's Cyclopedia. It clearly has a dash between the H and the 39. My best, Blaine Hadfield Arrowhead Models Don't sweat it, Blaine, a lettering error is far, far minor compared to a dimensional error and I'm just tickled pink to have a killer H39. I'm a modeler, and I'll do some modeling to fix the error on my cars. |
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Post by roadkill on Aug 7, 2018 4:52:21 GMT -8
I've got a nice sized stack of the old but incredibly accurate Middle Division PRR hopper decals that I now have no idea what to do with  ! |
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Post by Great-Northern-Willmar Div on Aug 7, 2018 5:17:46 GMT -8
I've got a nice sized stack of the old but incredibly accurate Middle Division PRR hopper decals that I now have no idea what to do with ! Buy some of Blaine's undecorated kits and have at it!!!!!  |
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Post by roadkill on Aug 7, 2018 7:49:27 GMT -8
I've got a nice sized stack of the old but incredibly accurate Middle Division PRR hopper decals that I now have no idea what to do with ! Buy some of Blaine's undecorated kits and have at it!!!!! Well, yea, there's that ! |
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Post by csxt8400 on Aug 7, 2018 8:17:37 GMT -8
This just doesn't look good for the image that Blaine was putting out before the model announcement. The website, the accolades, and the packaging video really conveyed a red carpet feel to me. The model looks very nice, as has been stated, but the glaring mistake on the flagship model is a pill that must be hard to swallow. Not to mention, PRR is a pretty well represented fixture in this hobby, and there are no doubt many more eyes on this because of that.
I do feel like this will ensure all future releases to be even closer to perfect, though, so that may be the silver lining.
Now where are those auto parts cars?
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Post by TBird1958 on Aug 7, 2018 9:36:23 GMT -8
I can't argue with the logic that the model *should* be correct........
The modeler in me sees this as something so easily fixed that it's almost a non issue. If I needed PRR cars I'd be adding ACI plates at a bare minimum to make them correct, reweigh data as well. I'd paint the wheels and weather it as well, it's a coal hopper. Pretty much what I'd do for any better quality piece of rolling stock from any of the better manufacturers. Seems like the ability to bitch is the direct inverse of modeling skill for some.
Mark Hills
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Post by kpack on Aug 7, 2018 10:36:16 GMT -8
I'm having a hard time finding shots of the prototype cars (all three roadnames) on my normal go-to websites, like rrpicturearchives.net. There are a small handful of pictures there, but not much that is helpful for weathering. Anyone know where I can find some decent pictures? I'd prefer some pics of something that survived to modern times, but would still be interested in good color pictures from back when the cars were in normal service. Despite these cars being out of my modeling era, I'd still love to take a crack at weathering one or two.
-Kevin
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Post by dti406 on Aug 7, 2018 11:34:52 GMT -8
I'm having a hard time finding shots of the prototype cars (all three roadnames) on my normal go-to websites, like rrpicturearchives.net. There are a small handful of pictures there, but not much that is helpful for weathering. Anyone know where I can find some decent pictures? I'd prefer some pics of something that survived to modern times, but would still be interested in good color pictures from back when the cars were in normal service. Despite these cars being out of my modeling era, I'd still love to take a crack at weathering one or two. -Kevin Not on the internet, may need to buy this book: www.amazon.com/Pennsylvania-Railroad-Steel-Open-Hopper/dp/0965536548Lots of good pictures, it was also published in parts in Model Railroading - July 93 issue, lots of PRR Pictures including the one in red paint. Sorry, but for $49.95 I think the lettering should be correct, that is the easiest thing to fix if somebody had been able to proof the model before final painting and lettering. When Atlas showed the DT&I Company service car in blue paint, the DT&I modelers flooded Atlas with E-mails that it should be black, and Atlas corrected the problem. Sometimes secrecy makes for a major error. And Blaine should know about problems like that with the Erie Western green paint fiasco. Regarding ACI Labels, these cars ran for ten years on the PRR before ACI labels were starting to be used, so they were probably added in a hit or miss fashion, so the modeler should be adding them on their own. Rick Jesionowski |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2018 11:49:54 GMT -8
I'm having a hard time finding shots of the prototype cars (all three roadnames) on my normal go-to websites, like rrpicturearchives.net. There are a small handful of pictures there, but not much that is helpful for weathering. Anyone know where I can find some decent pictures? I'd prefer some pics of something that survived to modern times, but would still be interested in good color pictures from back when the cars were in normal service. Despite these cars being out of my modeling era, I'd still love to take a crack at weathering one or two. -Kevin Kevin, Your modeling the modern era. Go here for the Conrail cars. conrailphotos.thecrhs.org/ConrailEquipment/FreightCars/Hoppers/3Bay/H39Brian |
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Post by crrcoal on Aug 7, 2018 14:13:04 GMT -8
. Sorry, but for $49.95 I think the lettering should be correct, that is the easiest thing to fix if somebody had been able to proof the model before final painting and lettering. Rick Jesionowski I'm sure most agree that is true and it's being belabored to the point now that it's twenty lashes with a wet noodle. I'm sure Blaine is well aware of that fact by now. So now what? Since we know what the problem is, what is the solution. A few more lashes for good measure? Nah no more lashes, but maybe Blaine should knock a couple dollars off the PRR car or at the very least offer a decal sheet to the buyer so it can be fixed if desired. That should make quite a few folks happy and IMHO it is the right thing to do. Manufacturers want top dollar for rolling stock then they need to be spot on. My fear is if people don't buy the cars and Blaine sits on unsold stock, it may impact a 2nd run. |
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Post by drolsen on Aug 7, 2018 15:57:03 GMT -8
I honestly don’t think Blaine is going to have any issue selling out this PRR run to people who either don’t care about the data issue or are planning to patch over it anyway to model cars in later service. I’d recommend that anyone else who is really bothered by it should just wait for the next run.
Dave
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Post by edgecrusher on Aug 10, 2018 6:29:56 GMT -8
Well I ordered two for myself and my order number was 1080, so clearly people are buying them. I'm sure pales in comparison to the quantity required to be a production run. For how good this model looks the printing error is pretty much a non issue for me. I model the late 60s so I'm pretty sure those would have been shopped at some point by my modeling era. A little decal work certainly won't kill me. I feel a little strange if all I have to do is open a box change couplers and weather a model. Is there such a thing as RTR guilt?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2018 9:25:10 GMT -8
Yes!!!
I get the same feeling.
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Post by edgecrusher on Aug 10, 2018 10:21:10 GMT -8
Yes!!! I get the same feeling. Its funny, because of that feeling I almost almost bought them in undec. But I wasn't able to quickly find a readily available decal set. I'm hoping that Arrowhead might consider offering them. Heck if they wanted to offer a correction sheet with some re-weigh data on it I'd even pay a couple bucks for it. Otherwise decals like this seem to be up Daniel Kohlberg's ally, maybe he'll step up and offer something. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2018 14:10:15 GMT -8
![]() I'll say this again...Blaine has delivered cars that leaves me NO EXCUSE for not getting the Joppa Subdivision up and running now. I have high quality Missouri Pacific quad hoppers; and now a superb H39 in Pennsy and undec versions...with the possibility of Conrail and Penn Central to come for the Big 4 Interchange at Karnak IL. It's got me motivated again...to get going. Here's to seeing the HE-7A, B, C (14 panel 70 ton versions) eventually. Thanks, Blaine!!! joppasub.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Allison-1024-1024x696.jpg |
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Post by carrman on Aug 13, 2018 10:54:56 GMT -8
So next time any of you decide you want to crucify Blaine, I invite you to read the slogan on the new Atlas LP&N cars that just came out. Let me know if that's a worse error than Blaines.
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Post by nstophat on Aug 13, 2018 12:33:06 GMT -8
So next time any of you decide you want to crucify Blaine, I invite you to read the slogan on the new Atlas LP&N cars that just came out. Let me know if that's a worse error than Blaines. I didn't realize that there was a Longview (Massachusetts), Portland (Maine) and Northern.... What's their tie to Oregon!!!  !!! Russ |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2018 12:37:40 GMT -8
Wow. The Great "North EAST"? I thought Portland was in the great NORTHWEST?
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Post by kentuckysouthernrwy on Aug 13, 2018 13:13:44 GMT -8
Maybe it’s North East Oregon?
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Post by milgentrains on Aug 13, 2018 13:27:25 GMT -8
So next time any of you decide you want to crucify Blaine, I invite you to read the slogan on the new Atlas LP&N cars that just came out. Let me know if that's a worse error than Blaines. I guess that Blaine and Arrowhead Models has joined Scale trains in the group that we can not say bad things about or wrath will fall down on us. |
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Post by carrman on Aug 13, 2018 14:02:31 GMT -8
Going by the conniption fit some seemed to be having over one line of data, you'd thlnk Blaine had been the one that shot Lincoln. I remember being villified for pointing out P2K had done the GP38-2 with 42" radiator fans, and that Atlas had really hosed up the windows on the GP40-2. Now, one line of data is off and the worlds ending.
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Post by ambluco on Aug 13, 2018 15:54:14 GMT -8
So this all started with you! Going by the conniption fit some seemed to be having over one line of data, you'd thlnk Blaine had been the one that shot Lincoln. I remember being villified for pointing out P2K had done the GP38-2 with 42" radiator fans, and that Atlas had really hosed up the windows on the GP40-2. Now, one line of data is off and the worlds ending. |
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Post by ambluco on Aug 13, 2018 15:54:44 GMT -8
Did you see them in person? I have. So next time any of you decide you want to crucify Blaine, I invite you to read the slogan on the new Atlas LP&N cars that just came out. Let me know if that's a worse error than Blaines. |
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Post by carrman on Aug 13, 2018 20:07:08 GMT -8
Did you see them in person? I have. So next time any of you decide you want to crucify Blaine, I invite you to read the slogan on the new Atlas LP&N cars that just came out. Let me know if that's a worse error than Blaines. Hadf pics sent to me and my LHS looked at the ones he got in, and yup, same error in the slogan. |
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Post by nstophat on Aug 14, 2018 2:17:33 GMT -8
An environmental consulting firm I used to work for had an office in Portland Maine. Soooo... back on topic. The AH models were supposed to ship out on the 10th. It's PM on the 13th, any one get any shipping notices yet? Unfortunately not yet. My order was #(10)27 and I am still waiting to receive the shipping notice. Russ |
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Post by gevohogger on Aug 14, 2018 3:26:53 GMT -8
So next time any of you decide you want to crucify Blaine, I invite you to read the slogan on the new Atlas LP&N cars that just came out. Let me know if that's a worse error than Blaines. I guess that Blaine and Arrowhead Models has joined Scale trains in the group that we can not say bad things about or wrath will fall down on us. Well, he did set the bar awfully high by posting a thread about the friggin' cardboard box as if it was the best thing ever. |
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Post by edgecrusher on Aug 14, 2018 6:02:33 GMT -8
An environmental consulting firm I used to work for had an office in Portland Maine. Soooo... back on topic. The AH models were supposed to ship out on the 10th. It's PM on the 13th, any one get any shipping notices yet? I haven't seen anything yet either. But I also placed my order on the 10th, so I'd expect there are many ahead of me. Given this is the first release from a new company I'm a little more wiling to give them some leeway. And honestly we don't even know if Arrowhead has many/any employees, Blaine could be boxing these up in his garage by himself. |
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Post by Judge Doom on Aug 14, 2018 8:00:05 GMT -8
I guess that Blaine and Arrowhead Models has joined Scale trains in the group that we can not say bad things about or wrath will fall down on us. Well, he did set the bar awfully high by posting a thread about the friggin' cardboard box as if it was the best thing ever. I guess the moral of the story is, be careful with over-hyping and over-emphasizing things of lesser importance than the core product. Branding and fancy designs are nice and all, but at the end of the day, most people don't really care how exquisitely designed or engineered a box is - it's the model that counts. |
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Post by ambluco on Aug 14, 2018 9:04:24 GMT -8
What's interesting about the box is it's a retro box. No window. I can recall at many hobby shops, specially the smaller ones, there being a sign where the cars were (Athearn blue boxes, etc) that said 'Please don't open the boxes - Bring to the counter for help."
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