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Post by fishbelly on Jul 24, 2020 8:04:42 GMT -8
Does the ST kit come with sloped and square bearing journal boxes like PRR #6152 above has? Thanks, Mark No, I have the undecorated PRR version and it only comes with Hyatt roller bearing journals. No square or sloped boxes.
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 24, 2020 8:21:49 GMT -8
Thanks for posting those photos fishbelly! Ok, I think I see what is going on with the ST truck. Since they opted to mold the spring detail it seems they had to move it forward (thus making the spring more visible). Other manufacturers didn’t include the spring and just have an open void. Proto Kato I’m going to order one of the undecorated kits and see if I can model an extended cab Reading unit. I doubt ST will be molding a separate cab for just one road and only 5 units. Thanks, Mark Wondering if Proto reworked their truck sideframes That hole above the end axles is off. Looks like the brake cyl mounting hole, two holes above the center axle. :/
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 24, 2020 8:25:35 GMT -8
I'd post up some Athearn, but since they flushed everything that isn't current from their website... Grrrrrr. Who thought that was a good idea? OK, thank Irv the trucks are still for sale. Here's the low cylinder flexicoil, better save a pic before they go OOS and the picture is removed. www.athearn.com/ProdInfo/LargeImages/ATH40076.jpg
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Post by csxt8400 on Jul 24, 2020 8:28:33 GMT -8
Well, maybe, but they only had one SD40 pre CN.
Let's not forget that from 2001-2006 the CN had DWP and GTW straight 40's, WC and GTW sublettered SD40-3's (ex Gec Alsthom and KCS, nee CN), IC SD40-2R's, and CN's own 6000 series SD40u's. That is a lot of flexicoils, not even counting the SD38's and other SD45's. It could have came from any of those.
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Post by csxt8400 on Jul 24, 2020 8:31:06 GMT -8
Thanks for posting those photos fishbelly! Ok, I think I see what is going on with the ST truck. Since they opted to mold the spring detail it seems they had to move it forward (thus making the spring more visible). Other manufacturers didn’t include the spring and just have an open void. Proto Kato I’m going to order one of the undecorated kits and see if I can model an extended cab Reading unit. I doubt ST will be molding a separate cab for just one road and only 5 units. Thanks, Mark Wondering if Proto reworked their truck sideframes That hole above the end axles is off. Looks like the brake cyl mounting hole, two holes above the center axle. :/ Proto did rework the trucks, and made them worse. A trend that has been happening a lot lately which I am extremely confused about. The new Athearn RTR 100 ton trucks come to mind as well. That offset hole is a lovely design aspect for triple clasp brakes, I believe. I have a few and someday, if they ever reach the layout before Scaletrains does them all, I'll have to fill it in with putty.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2020 8:33:02 GMT -8
I'd post up some Athearn, but since they flushed everything that isn't current from their website... Grrrrrr. Who thought that was a good idea?
When you're at the RTR SD45 page off to the left under "narrow by availability" there's a box that says "view retired models". Check that box then hit the yellow search button at the top of the page. Doesn't bring up every single one they ever made, but enough to get a good view of the trucks.
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 24, 2020 8:36:40 GMT -8
I'd post up some Athearn, but since they flushed everything that isn't current from their website... Grrrrrr. Who thought that was a good idea?
When you're at the RTR SD45 page off to the left under "narrow by availability" there's a box that says "view retired models". Check that box then hit the yellow search button at the top of the page. Doesn't bring up every single one they ever made, but enough to get a good view of the trucks.
Found the trucks by themselves, which actually gives a good idea if the coil bolster spring setback www.athearn.com/ProdInfo/LargeImages/ATH40076.jpg
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 24, 2020 8:47:38 GMT -8
Wondering if Proto reworked their truck sideframes That hole above the end axles is off. Looks like the brake cyl mounting hole, two holes above the center axle. :/ Proto did rework the trucks, and made them worse. A trend that has been happening a lot lately which I am extremely confused about. The new Athearn RTR 100 ton trucks come to mind as well. That offset hole is a lovely design aspect for triple clasp brakes, I believe. I have a few and someday, if they ever reach the layout before Scaletrains does them all, I'll have to fill it in with putty. I might drill the hole through and melt and pull some sprue plastic through to fill it up. Or even drill, tap and put a nylon screw in if I could find one small enough. I don't know how things get fixed so they're even worse. Draftsmen who have never seen what they're drawing IRL or sloppy/changing project management. People leave and companies don't replace them, they just pile more work on whoever is left. All the mistakes we see should get caught at first samples review. Smarter companies put the test shots up for public review. Heck of a lot cheaper to fix stuff before it goes into production. Rule of thumb is problems cost increases 10X for every step in the design/prototype/production process. That is if companies decide to fix them at all. I'd always pit my stuff up for internal or customer review. I wanted everyone to tear it apart. It's never personal, it's about making the product the best it can be.
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Post by markfj on Jul 24, 2020 9:00:42 GMT -8
My photo of the Proto truck is an early model offered in the gray box.
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 24, 2020 9:13:22 GMT -8
My photo of the Proto truck is an early model offered in the gray box. I know Walthers Proto upgraded a lot of their models to the 14:1 helical gearing, which was a great improvement. The sideframes look like they got halfway and didn't finish the upgrade. The Proto SD45 lists for $199/$299. Sale price is maybe 1/3 off. Still for those prices we shouldn't have to be modifying stuff.
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Post by Artur on Jul 24, 2020 9:17:49 GMT -8
Athearn also made new trucks and sideframes for the Genesis SD40M although they look slightly different that I look at them now.
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Post by Judge Doom on Jul 24, 2020 9:32:20 GMT -8
Interesting that the WC unit has Dofasco trucks on it, not knowing it's heritage I'm wondering how that happened. CN purchased the WC in the mid-90's and kept running its SD45's until the last few retired in early 2007, so at some point a CN shop probably did a truck swap and put a spare one off one of their units underneath. They still had a substantial handful of rebuilt/upgraded SD40's in their fleet until the great purge around 2008/2009.
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Post by csxt8400 on Jul 24, 2020 10:09:34 GMT -8
Interesting that the WC unit has Dofasco trucks on it, not knowing it's heritage I'm wondering how that happened. CN purchased the WC in the mid-90's and kept running its SD45's until the last few retired in early 2007, so at some point a CN shop probably did a truck swap and put a spare one off one of their units underneath. They still had a substantial handful of rebuilt/upgraded SD40's in their fleet until the great purge around 2008/2009. You're off on a couple years, which I already went into detail on above. WC was purchased in fall of 2001. GTW, DWP, and WC's lone SD40 were retired in 2006. Then of the rebuilds (all IC SD40-2Rs, all WC SD40-3's) were either returned to lesser or retired. The WC 6900's were returned in 2008, before spring. They were being rounded up in late 2007. The IC's didnt make it past the recession. CN kept the GTW SD40-3 rebuilds (KCS gray) that started at 5938. Some are in use at Memphis in remote service.
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 24, 2020 10:47:03 GMT -8
Athearn also made new trucks and sideframes for the Genesis SD40M although they look slightly different that I look at them now. Do they have rotating bearings?
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Post by Artur on Jul 24, 2020 11:39:00 GMT -8
Athearn also made new trucks and sideframes for the Genesis SD40M although they look slightly different that I look at them now. Do they have rotating bearings? I’m not sure, mine arrived today but I’m not home. I’ll check tomorrow and let you know.
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Post by espeenut on Jul 24, 2020 15:16:29 GMT -8
...regarding the visible spring thing, my thought is that a bit of realistic weathering will make everything "all better", it will visually make the springs appear more recessed...
One of the ones on its way is Southern Pacific road #8800, and there is a great photo of this unit on Rail Pictures.net that they must have seen as the model shot perfectly copies that angle. I can't wait to see mine, been waiting for a definitive SD45 for a long time...
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Post by thebessemerkid on Jul 24, 2020 16:05:22 GMT -8
...regarding the visible spring thing, my thought is that a bit of realistic weathering will make everything "all better", it will visually make the springs appear more recessed... One of the ones on its way is Southern Pacific road #8800, and there is a great photo of this unit on Rail Pictures.net that they must have seen as the model shot perfectly copies that angle. I can't wait to see mine, been waiting for a definitive SD45 for a long time... That's about as close to a dead ringer as one might ask for. Weathered models are always enjoyable to see. SP especially. www.railpictures.net/showimage.php?id=298548&key=1584404I remember seeing some wonderfully filthy Penn Central engines with "Wash me" fingerpainted on the nose.
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Post by simulatortrain on Jul 24, 2020 16:19:36 GMT -8
I’m going to order one of the undecorated kits and see if I can model an extended cab Reading unit. I doubt ST will be molding a separate cab for just one road and only 5 units. Thanks, Mark Tell them you're interested! I don't believe they've done the correct phase units yet.
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Post by Judge Doom on Jul 24, 2020 19:30:35 GMT -8
CN purchased the WC in the mid-90's and kept running its SD45's until the last few retired in early 2007, so at some point a CN shop probably did a truck swap and put a spare one off one of their units underneath. They still had a substantial handful of rebuilt/upgraded SD40's in their fleet until the great purge around 2008/2009. You're off on a couple years, which I already went into detail on above. WC was purchased in fall of 2001. GTW, DWP, and WC's lone SD40 were retired in 2006. Then of the rebuilds (all IC SD40-2Rs, all WC SD40-3's) were either returned to lesser or retired. The WC 6900's were returned in 2008, before spring. They were being rounded up in late 2007. The IC's didnt make it past the recession. CN kept the GTW SD40-3 rebuilds (KCS gray) that started at 5938. Some are in use at Memphis in remote service. That's right, I was thinking of CN's privatization date by mistake (1995). Plenty of time for truck swaps to happen. Even on Canadian stuff like CN/CP rebuilt GP9's, GMD-1's and SW1200RS, you'll see trucks with US-stampings under them that have been swapped at one point or another. Nevermind if things get sent to a contract shop for overhaul or repair work and get their trucks done. There's even other things that factor into it, like if a model was built using a trade-in unit or there was a trade-in parts pool for the order at the time it was built - whatever old trucks made it on the donor units over time might have found their way under the new units, or in a parts pool and under another railroad's locomotives. As I recall, the grey GTW rebuilds either came off-lease (they were long-term lease units) or were parked for disposition around 2009-2010 and had all their CN/GTW markings scrubbed, but CN ended up reactivating a number of them.
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Post by GP40P-2 on Jul 24, 2020 21:59:18 GMT -8
[/quote] Glad to see that the manufacturers can still crank out EMDs with the handrails leaning in toward the hood. If I get one of these, looks like I'll need to try the KV stantions.
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Post by fr8kar on Jul 24, 2020 22:06:04 GMT -8
Glad to see that the manufacturers can still crank out EMDs with the handrails leaning in toward the hood. If I get one of these, looks like I'll need to try the KV stantions. That's my only beef with the ST locomotives I have. It would be nice if a harder plastic was used. I'll tell you what else would be nice - being able to buy some of the plows and cut levers seen on some of these ST locomotives. I'd snatch several of those parts up.
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Post by GP40P-2 on Jul 24, 2020 22:13:09 GMT -8
Glad to see that the manufacturers can still crank out EMDs with the handrails leaning in toward the hood. If I get one of these, looks like I'll need to try the KV stantions. That's my only beef with the ST locomotives I have. It would be nice if a harder plastic was used. I'll tell you what else would be nice - being able to buy some of the plows and cut levers seen on some of these ST locomotives. I'd snatch several of those parts up. They are very nice units, and worthy of the praise given them. But the 30+ year old delrin handrail technology needs to go!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2020 3:42:36 GMT -8
Especially with prices increasing along with the passage of time.
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Post by riogrande on Jul 25, 2020 4:12:33 GMT -8
Especially with prices increasing along with the passage of time. That is a reason why it sucks to have to wait for 2 or 3 runs or more runs for a version you want finally comes out. I waited for the 4th run of Athearn Genesis SDP40F's before the San Francisco Zephyr version came out. Prices increased quite a bit over those runs.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2020 5:23:33 GMT -8
They can do a better job on handrails...that's for sure. Brian Banna used to have his own cast for GP35 projects...and they looked great. The old PIA castings look the part; even though they are bit short and a bit oversized. However, when the models are complete with them installed; the short height isn't as noticeable.
That being said...I've got little room to complain about ANYTHING. We are enjoying the best years of this hobby and have excellent models coming from all directions, IMO.
Kudos to all in HO.
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Post by riogrande on Jul 25, 2020 5:29:28 GMT -8
I agree. Things aren't perfect but they are pretty darn good!
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