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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 20, 2020 10:23:38 GMT -8
Since Colin said he missed my posts and since the physical distancing rules remain in place, I am looking at the classic Juneco 36' truss rod flat car as a possible project. I can build this car without having to leave the house as I have everything I need in my inventory. I have not built a Juneco kit in about 20 years but what little I'm reading about them online suggests they remain popular for some reason. That said, there is very little about these cars online which may simply be consistent with the unfortunate general lack of pre-WWI HO mainline modelling.
1. Any interest here in having me build this kit and sharing photos with you guys?
2. Has anyone here built and finished one of these kits and have model photos to share for inspiration, ideas and discussion?
3. Can anyone offer commercial product suggestions for interesting circa-1900-1910 loads? The loads I've seen in some old pioneer-era photos of these cars have been pretty spectacular and I would be willing to spend a little to buy a nice load for the car. I'm thinking of something like a period-correct fire buggy, early automobiles (these were just beginning to appear at this time in our history) farm implement or other cool ideas. RTR preferred.
4. Any online colour prototype or model photos showing how the top of the deck might be painted and weathered?
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Post by GP40P-2 on Oct 20, 2020 18:16:27 GMT -8
Just do it. We'll gladly watch your progress  |
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Post by talltim on Oct 21, 2020 2:35:20 GMT -8
I'm interested. One of my long-term projects is 1912 PRR, but I've only part completed a couple of gons before I got sidetracked. I've not come across Juneco before.
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Post by Christian on Oct 21, 2020 8:09:30 GMT -8
3. Can anyone offer commercial product suggestions for interesting circa-1900-1910 loads? RTR preferred.
The Athearn Waterloo Boy tractor is a bit later - 1918 in John Deere colors. 1912 in Waterloo Boy colors. (Whatever they are!) The very best detailed models in that era aren't RTR. They would be any of the Jordan Highway Miniatures which are kits. Most are teens and twenties models. You can dig and find earlier such as the farm wagons and other horse drawn models. Jordan closed a couple of years ago, but the prices haven't gotten stupid yet. The Athearn die cast has not been made for a few years, but seem to be quite common and cheap. Photo 1 - Athearn die cast. Photo 2 - Chester Fesmire model of a T delivery from a kit. Photo 3 - Jordan buckboard from a kit.    |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 21, 2020 9:10:51 GMT -8
Just do it. We'll gladly watch your progress Thanks for the reply. I'm gathering information right now and trying to collect answers to my questions before I proceed. It's too bad there is not much available from this era and the photos were black and white. From what I can tell there was a lot of stunning colour and design back then. But I guess no one is left alive from that time period and so few are modelling it. |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 21, 2020 9:19:26 GMT -8
3. Can anyone offer commercial product suggestions for interesting circa-1900-1910 loads? RTR preferred.
The Athearn Waterloo Boy tractor is a bit later - 1918 in John Deere colors. 1912 in Waterloo Boy colors. (Whatever they are!) The very best detailed models in that era aren't RTR. They would be any of the Jordan Highway Miniatures which are kits. Most are teens and twenties models. You can dig and find earlier such as the farm wagons and other horse drawn models. Jordan closed a couple of years ago, but the prices haven't gotten stupid yet. The Athearn die cast has not been made for a few years, but seem to be quite common and cheap. Photo 1 - Athearn die cast. Photo 2 - Chester Fesmire model of a T delivery from a kit. Photo 3 - Jordan buckboard from a kit. Thank you for this very helpful reply. I really appreciate you taking the time to post those images. As I mentioned above, it seems the pioneer era remains largely un-modelled with some exceptions. A quick check of Jordan prices on ebay shows $20-30US plus shipping per kit. That seems pretty crazy given these originally retailed for 1/3rd that amount.
One of the reasons I'm contemplating a load for this car is due to the lack of space to hide weigh. So far I'm still about 2 ounces short and I thought a load would offer additional hiding places. But at the prices I'm seeing on ebay I need to continue thinking about this. I suppose I could simply build the kit and let whoever ends up with it next figure out the weight problem. My stuff is just display case content anyway.
I welcome any additional input or answers to my questions from anybody.
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Post by GrandeGould on Oct 21, 2020 9:23:20 GMT -8
Ready to Run pre-1920 models? Haha, funny joke. We build everything round these parts. You're probably going to have to bite the bullet and build more kits if you want proper loads for that era. Inter-Action Hobbies makes several laser cut kits for 1911 Ford and 1905 Commercial Vehicle Co. trucks: www.interactionhobbies.com/HO-Scale_c_13.htmlBerkshire Valley offers excellent wagon kits: www.berkshirevalleymodels.com/apps/webstore/products/category/1558878?page=1American Model Builders has a large stationary steam engine kit, and a few of their structural load kits work well in the era: www.laserkit.com/laserkit.htmB.T.S. also makes some interesting cast metal machinery that can be used for loads. Their website seems to be down right now but it's btsrr.com. Wiseman Model Service has metal kits for Case steam tractors and steamrollers: wisemanmodelservices.com/HO-Scale-HOn3/HO-STEAM-ROLLER-CONCRETE-MIXER-LUMBER-CARRIER-AND-CASE-TRACTORRegarding the apparent lack of pre-WWI modeling, the problem is that you are not looking in the right places. You won't find very many around here or on the "mainstream" forums, but the Railroad Line forums, groups.io lists and a number of specialized facebook groups are gathering places for early steam modelers. There's more of us out there than it may seem, we just aren't loud about announcing what we do. If you are on FB, try the Pre-Depression Era Railroad Modelers group. |
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Post by Christian on Oct 21, 2020 9:37:39 GMT -8
GrandeGould mentioned the Wiseman (SSL) Case traction engine. Here is a photo which had no model builder name attached. It would be a quintessential farm load early 20th century headed to the virgin prairies of Manitoba. It's also one of the most difficult kits SSL made.  |
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Post by Christian on Oct 21, 2020 9:45:52 GMT -8
Other farm wagons from Preisser, Busch, and Noch are European prototypes but RTR. A bit of paint can make those wagons into brand new north American wagons heading for a dealer. The real wagons were brightly painted so that they would sell. We tend to think of them as raw wood because the paint didn't hold up and few farmers would want to spend the money to repaint. Here is a Studebaker wagon that could be painted from an RTR European model. Three of them on a flat would be a nice period load. BUT, I think priceyer than you want.  |
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Post by Christian on Oct 21, 2020 9:48:56 GMT -8
Finally, a ten pack of Tichy baggage wagons is $20 bucks and fairly simple to build.  |
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sd50f
Full Member
Posts: 101
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Post by sd50f on Oct 21, 2020 12:54:01 GMT -8
Wow...you show us CP SD40-2s and SOO vans...and now...a 1910 era flatcar? Yeesh...that's so far outside of my era...
And I'll gladly watch this build happen. Honestly, I love seeing what people are building, even if it's not my roadname, my country, my gauge, my era. It's great to see things like this on the site.
Unfortunately, I have no idea as far as loads for these cars.
Timothy Dineen
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 21, 2020 13:25:23 GMT -8
Wow...you show us CP SD40-2s and SOO vans...and now...a 1910 era flatcar? Yeesh...that's so far outside of my era... And I'll gladly watch this build happen. Honestly, I love seeing what people are building, even if it's not my roadname, my country, my gauge, my era. It's great to see things like this on the site. Unfortunately, I have no idea as far as loads for these cars. Timothy Dineen LOL Timothy, you are very perceptive to have picked up on this. Here's the thing about eras. I get the concept that MR pushed for years and actually do have an era that I follow. At issue for me is I have most of the models I want from my own era, yet I hope to still have many years of modelling enjoyment ahead. Does that mean I stop modelling, pack up my tools and find a new hobby? I decided I did NOT wish to become stagnant in my learning and model building so I've identified some areas that appear to be generally overlooked. Examples I've focused on to date (as you have noticed) include accurate steel cabooses (all roads), pre-1914 mainline (or "Class 1") modelling and mid-1990s eastern CP. The idea is not to become so stale and focused on my own subjective interests that I ignore and close my ears to everything else. I have thoroughly enjoyed and learned a lot from folks like the pre-Depression modellers, RPM modellers and the outstanding work I've seen from Civil War era modellers. It has all been a very refreshing learning experience from folks modelling the overlooked! So, thank you and everyone for supporting my journey through model building in this hobby through your comments, input, likes and private messages! |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 21, 2020 13:35:15 GMT -8
Ready to Run pre-1920 models? Haha, funny joke. We build everything round these parts. You're probably going to have to bite the bullet and build more kits if you want proper loads for that era. Inter-Action Hobbies makes several laser cut kits for 1911 Ford and 1905 Commercial Vehicle Co. trucks: www.interactionhobbies.com/HO-Scale_c_13.htmlBerkshire Valley offers excellent wagon kits: www.berkshirevalleymodels.com/apps/webstore/products/category/1558878?page=1American Model Builders has a large stationary steam engine kit, and a few of their structural load kits work well in the era: www.laserkit.com/laserkit.htmB.T.S. also makes some interesting cast metal machinery that can be used for loads. Their website seems to be down right now but it's btsrr.com. Wiseman Model Service has metal kits for Case steam tractors and steamrollers: wisemanmodelservices.com/HO-Scale-HOn3/HO-STEAM-ROLLER-CONCRETE-MIXER-LUMBER-CARRIER-AND-CASE-TRACTORRegarding the apparent lack of pre-WWI modeling, the problem is that you are not looking in the right places. You won't find very many around here or on the "mainstream" forums, but the Railroad Line forums, groups.io lists and a number of specialized facebook groups are gathering places for early steam modelers. There's more of us out there than it may seem, we just aren't loud about announcing what we do. If you are on FB, try the Pre-Depression Era Railroad Modelers group. This is an extremely helpful reply to my questions! OK fair enough, I will be prepared to work on more kits for the pioneer era. I'll check out those sites you mentioned and see if I can find something. A couple of possible loads that caught my eye are these beautiful buggies from BV. I just love the colour and ornamentation from these old time trains. It's a shame we didn't have better colour photography back then.   |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 21, 2020 13:38:59 GMT -8
Finally, a ten pack of Tichy baggage wagons is $20 bucks and fairly simple to build. Hi Christian, thanks for all of your suggestions and images in this thread. You've given me some real food for thought and I will consider all of your ideas. The Tichy baggage wagons are certainly an economical solution and worthy of consideration. The old tractor is beautiful but at almost $150 exceeds my price target. Lots to think about here, thanks again for the posts!! |
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Post by Judge Doom on Oct 21, 2020 16:10:48 GMT -8
Maybe it's similar to one of the flatcars used in the filming of CBC's "National Dream" series in the 1970s. According to this link about one of the passenger cars used ( www.railpictures.ca/?attachment_id=39675 ), CP rounded up some old MofW cars they had and backdated them to 1800s appearances for the films. It could be a good excuse to have a truss-underframe flatcar around, it has been a while since I watched them but I remember seeing one used during the scenes where they laid rails down. |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 22, 2020 6:53:15 GMT -8
This slip of paper was included in the kit and provides a clue about the basis for the model:
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Post by edwardsutorik on Oct 22, 2020 7:46:49 GMT -8
Here's a possible load:  However. Since we are apparently talking a CP flat, I think it better to model it as individual new parts, to be delivered to the customer. Thus the boiler would be packed horizontally, with the stack removed. The engine and gears would also be separate, and not on the typical two logs that you see in the forest. Here is a photo of what I think must have been more typical loads--"stuff":  If you open the above in a new window, you can get a very good view of the flat car loads. A person might also think that rough-cut beams would be transported on flatcars, from the coast to the interior flatlands. Ed |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 22, 2020 8:03:53 GMT -8
^ Incredible photos and suggestions, thank you!
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 23, 2020 14:43:26 GMT -8
Here are 2 of the 3 pages of the included kit instructions. I noticed these are not included on the HOseeker.net website. That great site has a very handy inventory of old kit instructions but does not appear to have been updated since 2018.  |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 24, 2020 16:51:15 GMT -8
Just a few of the parts and kit components I've been considering for this build.  |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 25, 2020 7:45:27 GMT -8
Fairly easy start to this kit. I drew a straight line to help mark the holes to mount the supplied Tichy stake pockets.  |
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Post by jbilbrey on Oct 25, 2020 9:15:50 GMT -8
3. Can anyone offer commercial product suggestions for interesting circa-1900-1910 loads? The loads I've seen in some old pioneer-era photos of these cars have been pretty spectacular and I would be willing to spend a little to buy a nice load for the car. I'm thinking of something like a period-correct fire buggy, early automobiles (these were just beginning to appear at this time in our history) farm implement or other cool ideas. RTR preferred.
Not RTR, but you might also look into some of Rio Grande Model's vehicles. The line is currently OOP, but there was a recent FB posting saying that the company had been sold and will return to the market. I have built their ditcher (looking back, probably not the best kit to start with but it was $10) and their Holt 75 tractor, and I have a Best Model 60 dozer in the stash. These are best described as the traditional multimedia craftsman kits consisting of white metal, brass wire, and sometimes wood and/or corrugated metal. If one takes his/her time, they can come out looking nice. One just has to be patient when building one. Good luck on the flatcar. I am definitely following this build |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 25, 2020 12:37:09 GMT -8
Not RTR, but you might also look into some of Rio Grande Model's vehicles. The line is currently OOP, but there was a recent FB posting saying that the company had been sold and will return to the market. I have built their ditcher (looking back, probably not the best kit to start with but it was $10) and their Holt 75 tractor, and I have a Best Model 60 dozer in the stash. These are best described as the traditional multimedia craftsman kits consisting of white metal, brass wire, and sometimes wood and/or corrugated metal. If one takes his/her time, they can come out looking nice. One just has to be patient when building one. Good luck on the flatcar. I am definitely following this build Wow thanks very much for the recommendation. That company has a lot of great parts and odds and ends that would be very helpful for those modelling earlier era stuff. I'll take a look at their site and see if I can find something there. You reminded me of another company (Bitter Creek Models) which seems to carry a lot of similar parts and even has a very similar website. Thank you for commenting and following my build! |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 25, 2020 16:05:12 GMT -8
The instructions specify removal of two corners to make notches in the side sills. I used my trusty scriber saw for this job but please watch where your fingers are when doing this. Safety must always be top of mind.  |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 26, 2020 15:37:17 GMT -8
These are the supplied pieces of wood that will be used for the end buffer blocks and draft gear bearing plates. I have marked their lines but will hold off on cutting them until ready to use them. Less chance this way of losing the smaller parts in the meantime.  |
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Post by slowfreight on Oct 27, 2020 8:55:09 GMT -8
Many moons ago, I built a Quality Craft 86' box car. I did it because the kit was $4, and an Athearn was $8. Kits like this always struck me as scratch building with directions, but given enough time, wood dope, and scrubbing with fine steel wool they turn out well.
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Post by Christian on Oct 27, 2020 11:16:43 GMT -8
Many moons ago, I built a Quality Craft 86' box car. I did it because the kit was $4, and an Athearn was $8. Kits like this always struck me as scratch building with directions, but given enough time, wood dope, and scrubbing with fine steel wool they turn out well. On the other hand - just into the opening steps of this project I can see why I've totally turned to styrene. I'll continue watching for reasons of nostalgia. Not for project inspiration. Wooden parts, dope, steel wool, and other such materials and actions are well left back in the stone age of the hobby. |
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Post by sd40dash2 on Oct 27, 2020 11:38:30 GMT -8
On the other hand - just into the opening steps of this project I can see why I've totally turned to styrene. I'll continue watching for reasons of nostalgia. Not for project inspiration. Wooden parts, dope, steel wool, and other such materials and actions are well left back in the stone age of the hobby. Hmmm those are interesting comments. I did look to replacing everything with styrene on this project but then I considered that the prototype is made of wood. I know you can sand styrene to simulate wood but it's not the same. IMHO styrene is best for steel prototypes and wood is best for wood prototypes. For the record I'm not using dope or steel wool here, just weldbond and ACC, same as if the car was made of styrene. |
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Post by slowfreight on Oct 27, 2020 12:05:45 GMT -8
On the other hand - just into the opening steps of this project I can see why I've totally turned to styrene. I'll continue watching for reasons of nostalgia. Not for project inspiration. Wooden parts, dope, steel wool, and other such materials and actions are well left back in the stone age of the hobby. Hmmm those are interesting comments. I did look to replacing everything with styrene on this project but then I considered that the prototype is made of wood. I know you can sand styrene to simulate wood but it's not the same. IMHO styrene is best for steel prototypes and wood is best for wood prototypes. For the record I'm not using dope or steel wool here, just weldbond and ACC, same as if the car was made of styrene. If I can find the car, I'll snap a few photos of it. Filling the wood grain was horribly time-consuming but made a big difference. The prototype was a steel car, which is why I had to go to great lengths to get rid of the graininess. And my flatcar decks are done with stripwood because even laser-cut wood can't give the right look, let alone plastic. |
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Post by nsc39d8 on Oct 27, 2020 13:07:05 GMT -8
I like this build so far. Working with wood kits can be a challenge. When I did my bridge abutments I used this pine wood derby sealer: www.pinewoodpro.com/wood-primer-sealer-primes-wood-before-painting.htmlYou can find it at different places and I actually think I got mine at Hobby Lobby. Seals nicely and the wood grain did not show thru. It is sandable and it worked nice in my abutments to simulate concrete. Keep up the great work! |
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