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Post by nsc39d8 on Feb 19, 2021 7:18:28 GMT -8
Mark,
I can say that I was not impressed with the Tru-Color PC green. I would use the PollyScale or Scalecoat2.
I will also say I am glad I kept my order to one car, a Southern Railbox renumber.
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Post by gevohogger on Feb 19, 2021 7:25:07 GMT -8
Soon, the fanboys and defenders will be here ... I saw those terms used yesterday in the Atlas thread, too. Do such people exist? I thought only certain companies had fanboys and defenders.
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Post by riogrande on Feb 19, 2021 7:47:54 GMT -8
^ Don't assume it will be quite that easy. The CC companies will want to know if you are able to contact the company to discuss it with them and if you are still receiving product. In the case of the product being provided, but the nature of the product itself not being satisfactory, they may tell you to take it up with the company directly. CC issuers aren't always interested in getting involved in these types of disputes. 100% depends on the CC card brand / company. Polices vary and the requirements vary. Some are VERY customer friendly, others not so much. Your results may vary. Both my wife and I have dealt with a number of CC disputes over the past year. Our CC companies didn't force us to deal with the companies in question, although we did try in some cases anyway. They resolved all of the disputes.
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Post by drolsen on Feb 19, 2021 8:57:09 GMT -8
After reviewing the comments and photos posted here and on the MFCL group, I’ve decide my cars will get repainted. It looks like the bottom is secured to the body with screws so I don’t anticipate many problems getting the cars disassembled. Looking for advice on paint and decals for the PC and RBOX cars. These items are sitting in a shopping cart on eBay and wait for me to complete the transaction. Any comments before I buy? - Tru-Color TCP-081 RBOX Railbox Yellow
- Microscale 87-1291 Railbox RBOX & ABOX
- Microscale 87-1096 Penn Central box cars w/PC-style lettering
Mark, I'm pretty sure I recall a discussion about a decade ago on the MFCL about how Microscale revised the as-delivered Railbox decal set, 87-1291. The original set apparently had a lot of accuracy issues, but Microscale fixed both the lettering and the colors of the logo, if I recall correctly, so you should be good to go with that set. I really wish Microscale would provide larger, higher resolution images of their decal sheets (maybe they're worried about people copying the artwork), but I think the image shows a revision date of 06/08. I'm anxious for my CSX cars to arrive so I can do a good, thorough comparison of the model to prototype photos. The photos on their website are pretty ridiculous, and I can't even make out some of the small font. There are some obvious lettering issues (like the inexplicable long line under the CSX "S", which is supposed to be the same length as the S is wide). What I'm not seeing yet is dimensional issues that some people have alluded to, mainly because the photos are such poor quality that it's hard to tell. The roof eaves look a little suspect, like there's too large a gap between the top chord and the roof, but I'll have to look at the model in person. The PS 5077 is a really important boxcar prototype for me, personally, as a CSX modeler. I hate to say it, but I'm going to have to live with and/or fix any issues with these models. Really hard to judge the CSX blue, but I'm hoping that it will at least serve as a good base color in the event that I need to redo some, or even all of the lettering. I may replace the end ladders with ExactRail parts, because although I think the dimensions are correct, the wide stiles appear to throw off the proportions. I can fix door hardware (although the CSX doors look pretty good, maybe missing the locking lever). I can pop doors off and thin them down if they stick out too far. I don't want to do any of that stuff, but I want to have PS 5077 boxcars to run with my Atlas FMC 5077s and, hopefully, Moloco ACF 5090s some day. Plate B boxcars are an important component of the CSX boxcar fleet, and I want all those variations in my CSX model fleet. The consequence of any shortcomings in this model, for whatever it's worth, will just be that I'll avoid or treat future NARC models with significant suspicion prior to their release. I've never been a fan of how difficult it is to interact with and purchase anything from PWRS. I ordered four of their Canadian cylindrical hoppers back in 2012 after a bunch of back and forth over email and Skype (while I was deployed overseas). I haven't ordered anything since, until these boxcars, not because I wasn't interested in their products, but because it was such a hassle to navigate their website and update my address and payment information (which had to be done via phone, even though I had an account set up on their site). What I do like about PWRS / NARC is their willingness to produce new models of interesting prototypes, and go to great lengths to create different prototype variations, something only a few other manufacturers, like Moloco and Tangent, have been willing to do. I know all those variations are almost solely the result of the research and design work that Darrell has done for them. The problem seems to be in the company's willingness to execute the design correctly. I think a lot of the concerns voiced here could be avoided if they offered these models as undecorated kits (for me, at least), but I know that's not going to happen, especially with a model like the PS 5077 that has some many body and detail variations (I think it would almost require a separate undecorated kit for each roadname). I think I'm basically going to have to treat these models as if the CSX version that I ordered is an assembled kit that I may have to disassemble and/or strip and rebuild the way I want it. I could probably go on for five more paragraphs about all my thoughts on this model, but I've run out of steam. Dave
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Post by drolsen on Feb 19, 2021 10:52:53 GMT -8
For those who want to compare and tally the issues... There are some pretty major detail and dimensional errors on these cars, and that's before we get to the paint and lettering issues. A shame, really... a nice model of the Pullman-Standard 5077 cars is needed. This doesn't appear to be it. -Rick Selby I just noticed something both frustrating and odd. It looks like PWRS got the "The nationwide boxcar pool" lettering right on the patched Southern version of the model. The image is so small that it's hard to be sure, but it has the capital "T" and looks like the lettering overlaps the side posts in the correct spots: The "next load any road" lettering is still way too small, and the logo itself is a little undersized though. Dave
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Post by slowfreight on Feb 19, 2021 10:55:37 GMT -8
Mark, I can say that I was not impressed with the Tru-Color PC green. I would use the PollyScale or Scalecoat2. I will also say I am glad I kept my order to one car, a Southern Railbox renumber. Agreed. Had I known, I never would have used Tru-Color PC green. Normally Tru-Color is good, but in this case, don't believe the name. Unfortunately, I didn't realize it until decals were done.
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Post by csxt8400 on Feb 19, 2021 11:41:25 GMT -8
Mark, I can say that I was not impressed with the Tru-Color PC green. I would use the PollyScale or Scalecoat2. I will also say I am glad I kept my order to one car, a Southern Railbox renumber. Agreed. Had I known, I never would have used Tru-Color PC green. Normally Tru-Color is good, but in this case, don't believe the name. Unfortunately, I didn't realize it until decals were done. I know this won't matter to you, as we are always our worst critic, but I still think that's a rad car. The color doesn't scream "wrong" but I agree it doesn't give off the hue we as PC fans look for.
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Post by carrman on Feb 19, 2021 13:01:28 GMT -8
Mark, I can say that I was not impressed with the Tru-Color PC green. I would use the PollyScale or Scalecoat2. I will also say I am glad I kept my order to one car, a Southern Railbox renumber. Agreed. Had I known, I never would have used Tru-Color PC green. Normally Tru-Color is good, but in this case, don't believe the name. Unfortunately, I didn't realize it until decals were done. Thats a very nice car, and it looks very PC to my eye. What model was the base for your build?
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Post by upcsx on Feb 19, 2021 13:27:26 GMT -8
Does anybody know when PWRS will be shipping the boxcars out?
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Post by tom on Feb 19, 2021 14:13:05 GMT -8
After reviewing the comments and photos posted here and on the MFCL group, I’ve decide my cars will get repainted. It looks like the bottom is secured to the body with screws so I don’t anticipate many problems getting the cars disassembled. Looking for advice on paint and decals for the PC and RBOX cars. These items are sitting in a shopping cart on eBay and wait for me to complete the transaction. Any comments before I buy? - Tru-Color TCP-081 RBOX Railbox Yellow
- Microscale 87-1291 Railbox RBOX & ABOX
- Microscale 87-1096 Penn Central box cars w/PC-style lettering
These items I already have: - Microscale 87-1095 Penn Central box cars with NYC style numbers (1968-1976)
- Tru-Color TCP -044 PC Green
- Polly Scale F414368 Penn Central Green
- Polly Scale F414370 NYC Jade Green
I want to replicate a “new” or fresh paint look for both cars. Also I like how Tru-Color sprays, but will use Polly Scale if the color match is better for a new paint job. Thanks, Mark Highly recommend ScaleCoat Penn Central green to accurately match Penn Central freight cars. To me it is the closest match to the typical PC green. Also the PS built cars also came with narrow style PC numbers and the Microscale set has the normal width PC numbers. Probably will look off if you do not use the narrow style numbers. The narrow style numbers are available from the Penn Central Historical Society site. See: www.pcrrhs.org/store/decal/pch-10The PCRRHS also has decals for the normal PC numbers too. The are better done than the numbers in the Microscale set. Good luck!
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Post by slowfreight on Feb 20, 2021 18:19:48 GMT -8
Agreed. Had I known, I never would have used Tru-Color PC green. Normally Tru-Color is good, but in this case, don't believe the name. Unfortunately, I didn't realize it until decals were done. Thats a very nice car, and it looks very PC to my eye. What model was the base for your build? It's a Funaro and Camerlengo X29, with a modified side sill and most of the original resin details replaced with Kadee and wire parts. I built 3 at the time. One was PC, one PRR, and one patched PRR.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2021 21:11:12 GMT -8
Wow, fanboys...Over time and based upon new information I challenge and then modify my opinions as needed. The manufacturers I liked at one point maybe a year ago, well maybe I don't feel exactly the same way today. Stuff happens. My opinion changes as new products get released, based as much as possible on objective evidence and how well products are made (or not). I don't like to pile on and trash manufacturers, but sometimes it becomes almost too easy. I don't always agree with people here (and prefer to remain anonymous) but I do read and consider many threads.
I am disappointed the PS 5077 boxcar appears to have so many issues.
I am fortunate in one respect: having been burned by PWRS in the past and their constant calling and badgering to buy all model railroad products only from them...I decided to take a wait and see approach and not pre-order any of these cars.
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Post by atsf2021bnsf on Feb 22, 2021 1:27:14 GMT -8
After a lengthy conversation with PWRS about the failings in the lettering of the original Railbox cars the other day Dan Huberman suggested that there was a possibility of re-printing that particular car. I have cancelled orders for the original car and for its stencilled variants.
Who knows ? But "If" the car is re-done I plan to use the original car to do the stencilled versions - I know there are Railbox decals from Microscale but does anyone do lettering for the "Southern" and "SBD" stencils.
JM
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Post by markfj on Feb 22, 2021 4:21:07 GMT -8
It’s encouraging that PWRS is at least considering taking actions to correct the Railbox car lettering.
Also, thanks to all who commented on my post regarding paint and decals. My order for the Microscale PC decals was already in before I saw Tom’s post regarding the better decals available at PCRRHS. I’ll get an order in for those and the ScaleCoat PC paint today.
I’ve waited so long for these cars that I’m not going to cancel my order.
Carrman, your F&C boxcar looks great!
Thanks, Mark
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Post by upcsx on Feb 22, 2021 16:23:17 GMT -8
They say the four that I ordered is on the way to the US warehouse and they will be going out in two days we will see when I get a tracking #.
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Post by carrman on Feb 22, 2021 18:17:41 GMT -8
It’s encouraging that PWRS is at least considering taking actions to correct the Railbox car lettering. Also, thanks to all who commented on my post regarding paint and decals. My order for the Microscale PC decals was already in before I saw Tom’s post regarding the better decals available at PCRRHS. I’ll get an order in for those and the ScaleCoat PC paint today. I’ve waited so long for these cars that I’m not going to cancel my order. Carrman, your F&C boxcar looks great! Thanks, Mark Not my PC box. I only wish it was.
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Post by markfj on Feb 22, 2021 18:25:37 GMT -8
My bad; sorry slowfreight. Great work!
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Post by cp6027 on Feb 22, 2021 20:10:29 GMT -8
Hope the NSC 5092 Combo-Door Box and MIL 4550 Cylindrical Covered Hoppers I have pre-ordered from PWRS/NARC turn out better than this! Shame given I have a number of their HST 4550s and enjoy them. No experience with their coal gon or more modern potash cars however.
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randy
Junior Member
Posts: 54
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Post by randy on Feb 23, 2021 16:12:23 GMT -8
Agreed. I contemplated reserving a number of these for the Chessie System Historical Society, glad I didn't. Was planning on a personal purchase of several NSC BCR 5092's but now I'm torn between rolling the dice on the cars being right vs. missing out on them if they are.
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Post by slowfreight on Feb 23, 2021 19:14:29 GMT -8
Hope the NSC 5092 Combo-Door Box and MIL 4550 Cylindrical Covered Hoppers I have pre-ordered from PWRS/NARC turn out better than this! Shame given I have a number of their HST 4550s and enjoy them. No experience with their coal gon or more modern potash cars however. A very satisfying alternative: Kaslo kit with one-piece shell that I was building right around when PWRS announced its car. I would be happy to add a second PWRS car, but in the mean time this kit built up nicely and has been finished for nearly 4 years. Kit/decals/trucks/couplers are sitting at $51, vs. $40 retail on PWRS car. Finding the necessary decals should be easier with the rerelease of many Herald King sets. Still hoping that at the lower price it's a nicer car than my resin kit.
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Post by cp6027 on Feb 24, 2021 6:30:38 GMT -8
Hope the NSC 5092 Combo-Door Box and MIL 4550 Cylindrical Covered Hoppers I have pre-ordered from PWRS/NARC turn out better than this! Shame given I have a number of their HST 4550s and enjoy them. No experience with their coal gon or more modern potash cars however. A very satisfying alternative: Kaslo kit with one-piece shell that I was building right around when PWRS announced its car. I would be happy to add a second PWRS car, but in the mean time this kit built up nicely and has been finished for nearly 4 years. Kit/decals/trucks/couplers are sitting at $51, vs. $40 retail on PWRS car. Finding the necessary decals should be easier with the rerelease of many Herald King sets. Still hoping that at the lower price it's a nicer car than my resin kit. Yes, a satisfying alternative if one of the Kaslo kits can actually be found. I know it's a sideline business but most of their stuff has been "out of stock" or "coming soon" for years and years.
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Post by stottman on Feb 24, 2021 7:35:14 GMT -8
A very satisfying alternative: Kaslo kit with one-piece shell that I was building right around when PWRS announced its car. I would be happy to add a second PWRS car, but in the mean time this kit built up nicely and has been finished for nearly 4 years. Kit/decals/trucks/couplers are sitting at $51, vs. $40 retail on PWRS car. Finding the necessary decals should be easier with the rerelease of many Herald King sets. Still hoping that at the lower price it's a nicer car than my resin kit. Yes, a satisfying alternative if one of the Kaslo kits can actually be found. I know it's a sideline business but most of their stuff has been "out of stock" or "coming soon" for years and years. From what I can gather with other cars, if you are willing to buy a large lot, they will rerun them. It seems to me that they farm everything out themselves.
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Post by markfj on Feb 25, 2021 9:50:34 GMT -8
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Post by drolsen on Feb 25, 2021 18:36:55 GMT -8
Mark, that definitely looks like a revised version of the decal set. They added a lot more options, like all the builder logos, on later decal sets and also overhauled a lot of older ones. Since this is a higher number set (1291), I believe it actually replaced the original RailBox set, which was an earlier 3-digit number. There were a couple guys at Microscale in the late 2000s / early 2010s who seemed to have gone through a lot of the old, outdated decals and replaced them with updated artwork. They also added a bunch of new sets, which was when I got to work with them on the CSX covered hopper and boxcar sets and the Cryo-Trans decals.
Dave
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Post by el3672 on Feb 25, 2021 20:24:54 GMT -8
Bringing up Tom's prior recommendation of using Scalecoat II PC green. I just found in my old paint stash (3) bottles of PCRRHS store bought issued SC2 PC green. Thanks Tom!
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ras
New Member
Posts: 29
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Post by ras on Mar 1, 2021 10:32:58 GMT -8
Mark, that definitely looks like a revised version of the decal set. They added a lot more options, like all the builder logos, on later decal sets and also overhauled a lot of older ones. Since this is a higher number set (1291), I believe it actually replaced the original RailBox set, which was an earlier 3-digit number. There were a couple guys at Microscale in the late 2000s / early 2010s who seemed to have gone through a lot of the old, outdated decals and replaced them with updated artwork. They also added a bunch of new sets, which was when I got to work with them on the CSX covered hopper and boxcar sets and the Cryo-Trans decals. Dave The one thing I note on this set that's still missing is dimensional data for the Plate B cars of 5077 CuFt. It would be easy to modify the existing decals when using them to represent the right CuFt capacity, but less so to fix any dimensional variations. It's odd that they omitted that bit given they have build date stencils for the Plate B cars (75-76), but otherwise, this revised RBOX set looks really nice. -Rick
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Post by txcavgr on Mar 2, 2021 9:46:43 GMT -8
Here's my update: Jan 23rd I was contacted to update my card so I could make payment. "Shipping soon".
Today, UPS shipping label notification.
Of course a label notification isn't the same thing as actually putting the box in the big brown truck.
Will post again when the box is in hand.
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Post by upcsx on Mar 2, 2021 12:53:15 GMT -8
My shipping says I will get the boxcars on the 5th.
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Post by txcavgr on Mar 3, 2021 7:06:39 GMT -8
In Transit 03/03/2021 3:10 A.M. Tacoma, WA, United States Past Event Shipped 03/02/2021 10:21 A.M. Bellingham, WA, United States Past Event Label Created 03/02/2021 9:43 A.M. United States
My cars are in motion, that is a good sign!
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Post by upcsx on Mar 3, 2021 13:11:35 GMT -8
UPS now says mine will be here on the 4th.
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